Chris Burres·00:20

Hi and welcome to the SEO podcast.  Unknown secrets of internet marketing.  My name is Chris verse. One of the owners of EWR digital, 

Matt Bertram·00:27

And my name is Matt Bertram. I’m the lead strategist here at EWR digital. 

Chris Burres·00:30

We have an amazing podcast for you today.  We don’t have guests very often, and this is an amazing guest.  You guys stay tuned.  You’re going to really enjoy it.  We want to talk a little bit first we’re sponsored by H ref.  So we’ve got to do our due diligence and our due diligence says, well, let me get the script here on the right place.  Says H refs webmasters tools is a powerful and free tool.  Age has created WT for website owners who can’t yet afford a marketing budget for a professional SEO tool, but need organic traffic to their website.  Almost 300,000 people signed up for the AWC the last year, since the product released, all of them use almost half of age rep’s product functionality for free Matt. 

Chris Burres·01:20

I think we’re getting a little feedback from yours.  Maybe turn your sound down seriously at $0.  Not even a credit card is required to sign up.  That’s always a, a plus tech radars said that AWC makes SEO more accessible to others.  It’s an amazing tool.  We use it in our office and are proud to be sponsored by them. 

Matt Bertram·01:41

I would just say for free.  All right.  Check it out. A trust, AWT.  All right. 

Chris Burres·01:52

All right.  So let’s jump right into it.  We’re not going to do any more of our formalities.  We want to jump into this today.  We have none other than Billy Jean, and we’re going to say Billy Jean is marketing in case like that whole tie doesn’t.  If the, just the name, Billy Jean doesn’t resonate with you.  I bumped into Billy Jean at affiliate Southwest and Las Vegas was able to have a great conversation with him and was like, Hey, like let’s hook up on the podcast.  This is going to be a lot of fun, but my team and really Matt exposed me to you. 

Chris Burres·02:27

Even before that, Matt, why don’t you talk a little bit about how we first encountered, and by the way, this won’t surprise you, but how we first encountered Billy Jean? 

Matt Bertram·02:35

Yeah, I’ll say so let me set it up.  So, you know, we got, you know, a team of like seven people crammed into a space, literally like working on tables and like TV trays, and like, we’re just like making it happen.  Okay.  And we’re all sitting around, you know, and we’re doing Facebook, we’re doing Google, we’re SEO, we’re doing whatever.  And then all of a sudden, okay, you know what, 2017, the Wolf on wall street, right?  Parody like paid, advertise the Wolf of Paul.  Well, paid advertising comes on and everybody like is like, what the heck is going on?  Everybody crowds around and like watches this video.  And like, it just blew everybody’s minds. 

Matt Bertram·03:25

And like, from there on out, like, you know, like it was just Billy Jean, Billy Jean.  And like, that was when, at least for me and my team, you like really came onto the scene and it was, I mean, it was awesome.  So we are excited to have you, I know a lot of teams watching, so why don’t. 

Chris Burres·03:45

You talk a little bit about that? 

Billy Gene·03:46

I got it.  I got to say, thank you for having me.  Let me, let me say thank you for having me.  And I appreciate the intro and the opportunity.  Like you say, you guys don’t have many guests on this, so you’re not, I don’t take that lightly and I’ll make sure that we spent some hot fire also too, in regards to the Wolf video.  I’m glad you guys found it in signing.  Cause people either love it or hate those s**t.  And that’s what that is. 

Matt Bertram·04:11

Well, I mean, tell, tell me a little bit about like, you know, I’ve heard a little bit about your backstory, you know, and, you know, be willing to share whatever you like, but I I’m curious, like, you know, where were you at in your life?  And when you were like, I’m going to like do this, you know what I mean?  And was that like the first, really big city?  Cause you’ve had a couple others.  Right.  You know, you have like the James Bond type video, you know, you’ve done some other like big videos, but I’m just kinda curious what was going on with you, like right around that time.  And how did that change. 

Billy Gene·04:42

When I decided to be stupid enough to do a parody of that?  Oh, I mean, you know, get into the industry.  What was going on in this digital marketer?  I lived in my parents’ house.  What was going on is I was embarrassed.  I mean like, no, one’s excited.  Like you go out, you meet people and people ask that question.  Oh, where do you live?  Oh, who do you live with?  You know, there’s this couple that cool, you know, say, so like, you know, my drive came from getting out of the situation.  There was no like change the world, like impact all this stuff.  Like there is present today.  I’ll keep it 100, like in the beginning.  Absolutely not. 

Billy Gene·05:19

How could I be thinking about the world when I was trying to figure out how to survive myself?  That was a challenge for me. I couldn’t think of anything else.  But then how do you know, fast forward, how to crazy ideas like that happen is I love to study.  I love to study.  And in regards to me, I was educating people on entrepreneurship.  So what is the most mainstream messages that was out there?  And it was the Wolf of wall street, and we don’t really get too many movies about entrepreneurship.  You know, you’ve got like a major blockbuster, like pursuit of happiness and I’ve done some things in that nature, but the Wolf was like the biggest. 

Billy Gene·05:53

And so as opposed to me trying to garner or fabricate attention, it was like, yo, it’s already here.  Let me just do our own version.  And then it just became a thing.  Matter of fact, when I walked into the office and I told the team, I have this idea, like we’re going to do this and modify and dah, dah, everyone was like that.  Wow, that sounds stupid.  But like, nobody was filling it, but I just had a gut.  And then, you know, me, myself, Paul, and the video team, we just went to work and just, we did it all in like four days. 

Matt Bertram·06:21

Well, you know, and what I would say about that is like that like idea you had to fully commit to it and fully get in character.  Right?  Like if you, like, you couldn’t do that. 

Billy Gene·06:34

I had to remember lines.  Yeah. 

Matt Bertram·06:37

Well, I, it was, it was just because it, like, I think it just showcased like who you were and what you were about.  And like, it just opened everybody up to you because to do something like that, you just had to fully commit.  And like, if it was half done, you know, I, you know, like, I don’t think it would have had like the impact, but do you just like, I mean, you just were like, boom, and like, we’d never heard of you before not being like, who is this dude?  And like comes out of nowhere.  Like I am the man, like, look at this. 

Billy Gene·07:11

Oh, you know, it’s passive like to work, or it’s not. 

Chris Burres·07:15

Literally, while you were given the keynote at affiliate Southwest, I was taking some pictures and sending them back to the team.  And they’re like, is that Billie Jean?  And like, yeah.  Yeah.  That’s Billy Jane.  That is really awesome.  Got to ask this.  Was that your, is that been your most successful video and right.  You could define that a couple of different ways or, you know, there’s a lot of people say, Hey, is it the simple cell phone video?  That’s a little bit better.  Cause it’s real, or the high production value that you put into that talk to us a little bit about what’s been the most successful for you. 

Billy Gene·07:49

Yeah.  I think you nailed it right with someone.  How do you define success?  But I think the way that, you know, for the sake of this podcast and just life in this case, it didn’t make money or did it not paying these bills will be bawling because of it or not.  And for the Wolf, yes, it was very successful financially.  I don’t know.  The damn thing was probably saying like 50 million times, something like that and probably, you know, generated some kind of multiple seven figures.  I, you know, I look at it as an asset.  Right.  You know, most people you say, what are you investing into?  A lot of people will say, I’m investing in the real estate. 

Billy Gene·08:21

You know, I invest into video content because it’s not, it doesn’t take as much money to get into that game.  Took me a couple of days. And I’ve been, I still use that video today.  Like there’s still funnels, we’ll incorporate it in just like people still use real estate as they, you know, our profit producing, you know, asset.  Right.  Like, same.  So to me that whole thing is, it’s just a better investment of realist.  I’m gonna sign no paperwork, no contracts, no messy stuff.  I ain’t worried about it going down.  Matter of fact, if it doesn’t work, I just turn it off.  You know what I mean?  There’s no risk there.  I’m going s**t.  I launched the first half of that question, Chris. 

Chris Burres·08:56

So, which was, so what has, so how valuable that was it.  Right.  Awesome.  And then talk a little bit about how that’s such high production value and maybe there’s a risk reward.  Right?  I think a lot of people are intimidated by video because they think it has to be perfect and that can get expensive or just even seems expensive.  And then like talk about, Hey, just crank out something on a cell phone, 

Billy Gene·09:21

Almost always profitable in regards to lowest cost per Lee, lowest cost per sale.  It’s almost always the ones where it’s either a cell phone or a single cam, like one bird almost all like even today, like that Wolf one, it was good.  It was good because you know, it made cells, but that’s more of a brand play, right?  Like here we are, you know, five years later.  And we’re talking about that view.  That was for the brand quote unquote, to be remembered.  But for the money, it’s like the combination.  Right.  And I would say 90% of our ads are here or a single cam. 

Billy Gene·09:53

And just talking to the camera simple as that, you know, but I, I do think you need to mix in like the big productions every now and then just to be remembered. 

Matt Bertram·10:02

No, I, I mean, we probably about two and a half years ago, were just seeing, you know, Facebook live was being big.  YouTube live has become big.  And were just seeing like the data on videos and we actually started on video production team to do that.  And then were mixing it in with like the video testimonials with the phone, right.  Like are just the most powerful, because they’re genuine, they’re honest.  The real, you don’t have that big production.  But yeah, I think the brand play makes a lot of sense because like, if you’re putting together about us video, like in, you’re a bigger company, you need that production component to it. 

Matt Bertram·10:39

You don’t want that on the phone, but you want the genuine responses to be, you know, completely genuine, you know, the days like three to one on most. Right.  As far as like engagement and that sort of thing.  But yeah, I mean that, I think that at least it, at least in my mind that put you on the map as far as like a brand play and then anything else you put out there was enough attention to like, look at what you were doing.  Right.  Like the different kind of funnels.  And, you know, when he came out with the little, you know, poker chip, right.  And one of my team members brought that in and we’re like looking at your funnels. 

Matt Bertram·11:15

I mean, so it was, I mean, I think that anchored right, the, the brand, I think you’re doing like a band thing, like you were doing a band thing.  Right.  You know, and that was cool.  And like massage empathy.  So yeah, I think I liked the wow factor. Right.  And certainly the entertainment, like when people listen to you and like, get to know you, like, you’re hilarious.  Right.  And like, you gotta be able to, you gotta keep their attention.  Right.  Like, can you maybe speak to a little bit of that as far as how, like, how important that is?  I mean, when you’re copywriting, right? 

Matt Bertram·11:53

Like just when copywriting, like, if you can’t get past the headlines, you’re never going to get into the meat of the article.  That’s where like the time has to be spent to like grab them, you know, and these from what I’ve seen on. 

Billy Gene·12:04

Yeah.  And entertain, educate, execute.  But I think there’s another angle that I kind of want to throw in there too.  Why we go so hard on video and just this whole style and the word is competition.  Like, I am very aware that we are not the only marketers in the world.  There’s a lot of extremely intelligent, you know what I mean?  Like that are fantastic and do an awesome job.  And anything that goes with a funnel is, look, you can put something out there and you can probably wait about 60 minutes before somebody else’s testing what you do.  And especially, even writing copy.  Everybody thinks that’s the golden ticket.  The problem with copy is you can copy and paste.  The second she put a drain out. 

Billy Gene·12:45

If it’s just words that are protecting you, virtually anyone can do it in the fastest time ever.  The videos are moat.  The video is, are, yeah.  Like how in the world are you going to copy that Wolf parody?  How are you going to copy the body language and the structure of dah, dah, like, you know, that is all a moat so that the competition can’t do it.  You know what I mean?  So that’s kind of like, for me, when I think of brand, it’s like, how can we create something that nobody else can touch?  And the truth is every part processes replicatable, but the content that creativity that’s a lot harder to do. 

Chris Burres·13:21

When I think also with you in the video, right, as the face of the company, as the face of the video and, you know, we kind of touched on a little bit of authenticity and that’s one of the things that Matt and I really enjoy about this podcast is because we get on, we’ve got like a zero edit policy, right.  One because, you know, probably better than us editing as a black hole of time, like Eight hours and good.  I’ve got 30 seconds ready.  Let’s move on to the next 30 seconds.  Right.  And so we got a zero edit policy and that authenticity really comes through and people make that connection because it really is a lot more about the connection. 

Chris Burres·14:01

Now you said something at affiliate Southwest, actually it was up on the board.  And basically you’re saying you smile by selling them crack.  Now tell me about your personal history with crack. 

Billy Gene·14:17

Well, personal history.  I’ve never touched crack sore, but yes.  And my presentation, like, that’s a great example of like, you know, my real job is I’m an educator and t-shirt my passion is that I want to educate people who feel like they don’t got a shot.  You know, that happens to be a lot of minority communities at times.  And me being a black man, that’s very important.  And so whenever I’m presenting in a video or whatever, I obsessed 90% of the video or the presentation about how am I going to make people laugh and smile, and like, not be able to turn their head the whole time.  Then I go into the content.  The content part is easy.  Like the actual teaching thing, it’s actually making somebody care about it. 

Billy Gene·15:00

So when I even come into a stage like affiliate summit west, I look at this bigger role and I see who’s speaking, et cetera. And you know, maybe sometimes figure out what they’ve done in the past.  And I try and figure out what’s everyone going to do perfect.  I’m going to do the exact f*****g opposite.  Yeah.  Right.  Like, you know, so if I’m going to speaker, I’m like, Hey, a lot of people are coming up here.  They’re talking about innovation.  They’re going to use these sides.  Great.  I’m going to double down on sites.  You know what I mean?  And then in addition to that, it’s okay, I’m going to present something and teach them.  But what are the, like, I’ll spend more times on my jokes.  Yeah. 

Billy Gene·15:31

They’re open to receive, you know, so my whole segment there was about like, everybody’s getting so freaking surgical about conversions and clicking this button and this split test and blah, blah.  I’m like the only thing that you need to split test is does your sales page make people laugh or not? 

Matt Bertram·15:49

And it. 

Billy Gene·15:49

Sounds so I’ll go ahead and map. 

Matt Bertram·15:50

No, just one of the things that, that I have heard you say is like the number one thing, like in funnels and Chris is by the way, running a ton of funnels.  Okay.  For another business is the offer, right?  Like that’s like all the surgical stuff that you’re talking about, you know, AB test the button, color, all this, like these are all marginal things.  Like, you really want to test something, test the offer.  I think it was another pocket.  You’re talking about a client.  I did like pink boxing gloves or, 

Billy Gene·16:20

Yeah, exactly.  And it just killed it for him.  Like, you know, the gym space.  Hello, competitive.  Everyone has a two week trial who cares, but they’re like, we’re going to give you free boxing gloves on they’re pink. What’s this like, because most of the time when we miss them cost per liter sell and we’re like turning off a campaign, it’s because we need a $10 cost per lead.  And it’s 30.  Like you need a 300% increase in performance.  You cannot get that from a freaking change of a color or like a little tweak.  It has to be, if you want a 300% change, you need to do something 300% different.  I tell my team all the time, like literally, if it sounds anything, like it’s not going to work. 

Billy Gene·16:59

It’s just a waste of freaking time.  Like we have to switch it.  That’s my whole thing.  So obsess about offers.  That’s how you guys got the USB is like, you know, at the time the free book, a free plus shipping books were really popular.  And I was like, yeah, that’s cool.  But I don’t really feel like writing a book right now.  So I’m just going to put all my s**t into a USB.  Right?  Like continuous innovation.  All right. 

Chris Burres·17:24

We get it.  All right.  Because the USB is a great way to deliver at a low cost.  Everything and. 

Billy Gene·17:30

F*****g story about that USB.  Yeah.  Like crazy.  This is so ridiculous.  So probably about 2017, 18, somewhere in there we’re sitting in the office, we’re gonna move forward with this free plus shipping thing.  But at first I was like, yeah, let’s just run an ad and tell everybody that I’m going to give them my best performing ads of all time just to opt in.  F**k it.  Let’s just email it to them.  Who, yeah.  So we test it and we do, and it sucked, our cost per lead was high.  It was like, and I was, you know, that was one of those moments where you’re banging your head against the wall.  Like, are you kidding me?  This is the best way.  How do you not. 

Matt Bertram·18:04

Know that we opted in belly to say, And we are one of them where you can go back and look at the list.  We, 

Billy Gene·18:14

Okay.  So we do that digitally.  Right?  And then I flip it and I go fine.  Let’s upload all this to a USB.  So now you have to wait for an in mail.  And then let’s say we’re giving away.  And people just have to pay the shipping.  Our cost per sell on the free plus shipping was dramatically less than our cost per lead.  And were now making money.  So that campaign flew.  And it’s just something about the physical.  The truth is most people don’t value information, right?  Like this group right here, we value information.  We represent, you know what I mean?  When you’re going mainstream, no it’s learning, you know, my shout out to my guy, Vince Reed. 

Billy Gene·18:55

And he always brings up a good point that we laugh about, which is if you’re in the information space, you just sell work and nobody wants to work. Like it’s like take a course.  That’s not a hook.  Another like I’m I was a crappy student in school.  Someone tells me to take a course.  I’m running I’m ditching class.  Like take a course.  I got a five-year-old what course you think I’m gonna take?  Right.  It’s work.  So I really had to kind of step back and just like rethink a good offer and put myself in the framework of that customer and anything that sounds like work a time.  Ain’t it.  And it’s part of the reason why three years ago, we started giving away all the courses for free, right? 

Billy Gene·19:36

Like when were just like, once we had Brandon list built up and were like here, just take all our courses for 30 bucks, 2 million bucks that month just giving away that stuff.  But the reason why I did it is because I, one, I wanted to reach more people. And I just got back from an event with Tony Robbins.  I was all in my fields, but the second component was, man, this industry is going down in flames in regards to coaching.  There’s too much competition.  I did a course for a guy who was at LinkedIn learning or something in there in Santa Barbara.  And I’m like, man, LinkedIn learnings in here, you got you Demi full steam ahead.  You got everything on YouTube barrier to entry is super low.  Everybody’s coming. 

Billy Gene·20:11

I’m like this s**t just, it’s not, this is not a thing.  So I’m like, as opposed for waiting for this whole thing to burn, I’m going to light the match and I’m just going torch it.  And so we did, we got, we got rid of the courses and then we just really focus on selling support and access, which are really the hot button. 

Matt Bertram·20:28

What I’ve found that, that’s interesting.  Kind of like in that same timeframe, I felt like people did want something physical because they could be like, I have this value in this thing.  Right?  Like I want, like, if it’s tangible, I got this book or I got this piece of value here and I’m going to go set it over here.  And I’m probably never going to look at it again, but I got it right there.  Right.  And the biggest thing that we found and you, you even hit on it earlier in your presentation is getting someone to care, to take action.  Because like people know how to lose weight.  People know how to do digital marketing. 

Matt Bertram·21:05

And then if you go in and like, look at their stuff, like, you’re like, you know how to do this.  We just had a conversation, but you’re not actually taking action and you’re not doing it.  And so. 

Billy Gene·21:17

Exactly why we just switched a few years ago, take the information, pay us to help you implement. 

Matt Bertram·21:24

What is it like, wait, what is the data point you’ve seen as far as if you give them the information people that actually use it, like it’s like 3%, 5%.  I mean, I don’t even know. 

Billy Gene·21:35

Like it’s low, but also what’s low is that people pay for the information that people to lose it, unfortunately like, you know, it’s just working.  It’s easy to deprioritize.  You know what I’m saying?  Like, so like our big thing that we sell is our weekly coaching where you’re on a call with us.  And then over the years, the message has changed every single week.  I’ll teach you a new way to get customers.  And it has to be that assemble.  And we just go through the week and we say, this is what you do.  Here’s the ad template.  Here’s how to do it now, go and do it.  Even with that, we’ll still have a lot of people not doing it. 

Matt Bertram·22:07

And you know, the biggest thing that Chris and I have talked about for a while, and he’s done a really good job out is, you know, he, you know, like we’ve invested in a lot of like education.  We do a lot of self-learning and we, we love to teach as well and kind of open up the book on like SEO, like it’s kind of black box.  And like, here’s how you do it.  Here’s what you need to look for.  Here’s, you know, full transparency and we, we can do it for you.  You can go do it.  Like, you know, like people think that those people that are going to go do it on their own are always going to go do it on their own.  Right. 

Matt Bertram·22:37

And then the people that are going to need help, always going to need help.  But the biggest thing is like the accountability, like having like the accountability of, Hey, I’m paying for this thing.  Like just like orange theory, right?  Like I’m paying for this thing.  I’m going to get built.  If I don’t go, like, it’s going to be a little bit painful, let me have an accountability partner to make sure I’m doing the things that I already know that I need to do to keep pushing it forward.  Right.  And that’s what it sounds like you do a really good job offering. 

Billy Gene·23:05

Yeah.  And then even too, like for anyone who’s like a course creator, I’m the teaching side out there where we do get outstanding results is when it is a week-by-week training from a to Z.  So like, Hey, we’re going to build a table together.  And in week one, I’ll mail you the parts and explain what everything is.  And week two, we’re going to put the leg on then week three, the other leg week for the other leg, the aid is Z from start to finish with a dangling carrot at the end, as the best way as a teacher has like close to enough, like there also to, you know, people appreciate it.  They just get the most value.  So like, honestly, all of our thing has focused on a 16 week certification. 

Billy Gene·23:42

And, you know, we rented out the Padre stadium for our graduates.  That’s how passionate I am about it twice. We’re doing it again next year.  But that is the focus because people have just been getting the most frequent wanes and coming through.  And then you also see them in the accounts receivable side and our cert classes.  We collect like 97% of that money.  And like people are finishing and having incredible transformations.  I’m like, this is a screw, all the other stuff.  And I just delete stuff like every now.  And when I think about scaling now, I’m just deleting stuff left and right.  If it’s a pain in the butt, if it’s not working, if it’s taking too long or people aren’t filling, I just stopped doing that to go do something else. 

Billy Gene·24:19

I’m figuring out the thing, you know? 

Chris Burres·24:20

And w w what, you know, there’s one piece to just marketing, right.  And then there’s another piece to marketing and delivering value.  Right.  So we’re helping your, your team, our team, you through training us through actually kind of executing the SEO services and some paid services.  And when you positively impact a business owner, like it just like the creative part is amazing.  Right?  It’s a lot of fun to make a, a Wolf of wall street parody, right.  That you had a blast doing that. 

Chris Burres·24:52

No doubt about it, but then to turn around and that’s bringing customers and you’re delivering value to those customers, like, we’re, we’re just so lucky to kind of have put ourselves in the position we’re in to have the marketing skills to kind of go out there and recruit people that we get to help. 

Billy Gene·25:09

Yeah.  And that’s the thing too, is we’re not afraid to get our hands dirty.  I’ve been for seven years, I’ve had a call on Tuesdays where I’m training live me in person, seven years of consistency.  You know, that’s like more of our backend people don’t see that as much because we don’t promote it that much.  But like, we show up, like we’re out there doing the work screen-sharing with people.  We’d probably build more ad campaigns with you.  I don’t, I can’t even begin to count, but like, I think there’s important, you know?  And a lot of people are afraid.  Like, you know, I think we have this very much, like, as you start to ascend in the entrepreneurial world, everyone tells you, like, you shouldn’t do that, let somebody else do it. 

Billy Gene·25:45

And I’m like, oh, how about if I just enjoy doing it?  You know, like, what am I enjoy working with my peoples?  You know?  So. 

Chris Burres·25:52

That is one of the advantages of success, right.  As you’re can, like, okay, I know that may not be high value, but you know, I I’m going to do it.  Right.  There’s copies are often not high value also, but no one will say you shouldn’t have a hobby. 

Billy Gene·26:08

Yeah.  That’s fine.  That’s good.  And it builds brand, you know, like the more front facing that I have with people, like it builds a true brand and true loyal fans.  Cause you know, a lot of people have followers.  A few people have a relationship though.  You know what I mean?  Like where you can actually log to a followers, a few people have influence, meaning that you can promote something and it actually goes off and sales, you can say, let’s do this, go vote, go chat.  You know what I mean?  Very few people have that. 

Matt Bertram·26:31

Well, you know, to do the burning questions that at least, you know, or comments, I don’t know, want to get your input on.  But you know, like having the, like, th you can’t do something that you don’t have, like, passion about, like, you can’t like be upset.  Like you gotta be obsessed.  Like, you know what I mean?  I, I I’m like addicted to SEL, like, honestly, because. 

Billy Gene·26:54

Like, I. 

Chris Burres·26:56

Yes we should, 

Billy Gene·26:59

I don’t know anything about it. 

Matt Bertram·27:02

Well, the thing is I can make a change to a website and then Google re indexes it, and I can see what impact that had and how that formulate, laid out on that link.  Right.  And so, you know, looking at whatever client, it is using a certain methodology and going all right.  If I make these changes, you know, there’s tons of different variables involved, but if I make these changes, let’s see how that all stacks up again.  And then there’s a reshuffling of Google.  And then you can see how that had that impact. 

Matt Bertram·27:30

And then you make another change and you see how that reshuffled and you kind of test things with variables, but it’s that kind of like, you know, there’s some instant gratification or a little bit delayed gratification, but to that, but you’re, you keep seeing that, that worker, that success, and then, you know, it even feels it when you know, your work, like, I guess this plays into my other question. So, I mean, certainly speak to it, but it seems like nobody was ever trained on like, marketing.  Like if you’re not a marketing company, so many entrepreneurs are like focused on product, or they’re doing this, or they’re doing that.  And like getting customers is how you shape the business. 

Matt Bertram·28:16

Like the funnel flow of new clients coming in, you can build the operations of the organization to handle that flow.  And like, what’s the first thing always cut.  Like, we, we saw it with COVID hit, like, what was the first thing that most businesses cut first-line on item, boom, let me get rid of marketing.  I was like, no, that’s when you need to amp up your marketing.  Okay.  And take market share, you know?  And I don’t know.  I just think that sometimes people have, well, you know, I’m talking about two different things, but some people have a really different view of marketing than what the value that it creates is.  And then other words also, you know, and I understand that people want to run their business.  Right. 

Matt Bertram·29:04

And they want somebody else to do marketing, but, but marketing drives everything.  Nothing happens until something gets sold.  Like nothing happens until something gets sold that, you know, you need to have a good product, but then like you got to build that machine, you know?  And I know that was kind of two different concepts, but, 

Billy Gene·29:20

Well, I resonated with everything you’ve said, I don’t know the question was, but I do everything Bro. 

Matt Bertram·29:33

No, no.  I just, I wanted to make sure to get those things out there because you know, sometimes you get so involved in certain things and you forget what you’re going to say, and you want to make sure to like, get certain messages out there.  And I just, I think that you want to be from the market if, for the marketer standpoint, like people ask, well, what should I do?  Right?  Like if there are people that we do a little bit of coaching for here and there, and it’s like, well, what are you doing with your agencies?  Like, do you like Facebook ads?  Do you like SEO?  Like, what are you most comfortable with?  Same thing with business owners.  Like what do you feel most comfortable with? 

Matt Bertram·30:06

Do you feel most comfortable with, in your sales process, kind of enhancing your sales process on the email automation side, are you in front?  Are you comfortable in front of cameras?  Would you rather just be SEO?  Do you want to be the face of the company?  Like these are all factors that you have to consider when you’re doing the marketing.  Yeah. 

Billy Gene·30:24

Well, you know, I think too, like to chime in there is I think some people overthink that question.  And I think the question that everybody, especially small businesses, right.  That we serve as a CEO every day, everybody should wake up and say, how many people am I going to ask to buy today?  And who is it?  And do nothing else, but ask those people to buy because we can get so caught up and I’ve done it, building a website, changing the logo.  You know what I mean?  Like having internal strategic meetings and button color, changing a button color, and then you realize you’re doing it in WordPress and it doesn’t actually have the hex code.  And so you’re downloading a plugin now and dotted on somebody walks over and they’re like, what’s going on? 

Billy Gene·31:07

You’ve been doing this for 90 minutes.  I’m trying to change this color.  Like what the freak, What, what are you doing?  So like in my thing, you know, even with our team and I’ve changed our daily metrics, right?  Like when we send them to very simple, how much money did you make today as a result of your actions?  How much money came in?  Cause it’s the only thing that actually drives everything that we do.  So like if you’re a CEO of a company, your time should be made, you know, especially in the beginning phases of just asking people to buy your s**t.  There is no other job.  Now you can do that by calling people, you can do that on knocking doors.  But the only thing you can not do is wait. 

Billy Gene·31:46

You can not sit on your heels and wait for something to come pick up the phone call.  So for me, I try and just do a blitz on every given any given day for every employee. I think about like even my customer service team, they’re going to get X amount of inquiries.  Awesome.  They can upsell those people under this.  They need to be making offers our marketing team.  We’re going to run ads on Facebook, Instagram, YouTube, how many people are going to see it.  Cause that’s how many people are going to ask to buy.  And I don’t run any advertisements heavily that don’t ask people to buy my s**t.  So I’m making offers there.  Then I’m going to go speak on stage.  And I’m going to ask people to buy my stuff. 

Billy Gene·32:19

I don’t do anything else, but ask people to buy.  And that’s why we grow because we are obsessed with that core singular component.  And then we’re even missing opportunities to do it.  For example, we’re not asking people to buy view VSCO.  I have no clue how to do that. I’m missing money right there.  So I just, LinkedIn, I should be running LinkedIn ads.  We did in the past.  I haven’t done it in a while.  I should be asking people there, every single in the more mech and this one, you look at like a corporate structure, a fortune 500 company or something.  When you look at how many different ways they’re doing it.  Well, it’s like one, they have 20,000 employees.  So every single day they have 20,000 people asking people to buy. 

Billy Gene·32:55

What does that end up being millions and millions of dollars of sales a day.  It’s the math.  It’s the math of there.  When you look at MLMs, what do they have?  They recruit salespeople to ask people to buy every single day.  Every growth strategy is surrounded by asking people for money.  And the only reason why people don’t ask is because they think their trade sucks. Money is nothing more than a trade.  People will throw money at you.  If you have some good s**t to trade for it, I got a Lamborghini.  If I said, Hey guys, I’m going to give you this a Lamborghini for a hundred bucks.  Everybody would throw up they’d sprint, come to my office right now, throw money, et cetera. 

Billy Gene·33:30

Because you know that you’re getting the better end of the trade.  So it was a company.  I asked myself, how can I make my students, my clients, my partners feel like they’re getting, they’re just taking advantage of me in this trade.  And I know I’ll have a crazy promotion.  And it always works like that.  When I put something out where it’s like, oh my God, is he serious?  Is he really doing this?  That’s how the offer has to feel.  Period.  If the offer don’t feel like that, I promise you.  It’s not going to blow. 

Matt Bertram·33:58

Yeah.  Well, I mean, look, money is just like stored up energy or buying power or ability to trade.  Right.  And so like, yeah.  I mean, we, we talk about it a lot.  You know, Chris, Chris, and I talk about a lot of different things, but it’s like, are we creating value for people in what we’re offering?  And are we pricing that appropriately based on the value exchange.  Right. 

Billy Gene·34:21

And is it being communicated well, right?  Yeah. 

Matt Bertram·34:24

Yeah, absolutely.  I think they got to be able to see it.  Like, I think like even, you know, when you know you, did you have left in analogy, Chris, I don’t know if you’ve ever heard this analogy and Billy, this is the first time I ever heard it.  And I think it’s a beautiful analogy about golf.  Okay.  About golf and sales.  You want to kind of, 

Billy Gene·34:45

Oh yeah.  I forgot.  I think it was Mike Marin or something.  I don’t remember who the hell it was, but I think he was the one that first product to my game, but it clicked so much.  And they said the relationship between marketing and sales can be dictated like golf in golf.  You drive the ball and you try and get that ball as close to the hole as possible.  So you can easily tap it in that’s marketing and sales.  The drive is marketing.  How close can your marketing get?  So by the time you actually talked to them, ask them to buy.  It’s just a little Putin. 

Billy Gene·35:14

But if you drive in and it goes into the sand, meaning you have horrible marketing, then you have salespeople who are going to be trying to close people.  And it’s just going to be hard to do every now and then you can make it work. But very rarely is someone going from sand to hole from water to hole.  And so, yeah, it was when I heard that, I was like, that’s exactly what it is.  And that’s why some people say, well, you don’t need a sales team if you have great marketing.  And I think the challenge is it’s almost to a detriment because now people don’t want to sell.  Right.  They just, depending on market, but they’re not good at marketing.  So you gotta be good at driving. 

Billy Gene·35:46

If you don’t want to, you know, have a short game, you gotta be excellent the best in the world.  So yeah. 

Chris Burres·35:52

So, so like a parallel to that is I’ve never met a broke marketing genius, like Exist.  And then you’re talking about the result of sales, the R in DWR has results.  And that is our focus.  We kind of very early on realized that great, you can talk SEO and you can get people into first position.  But then what, right?  Like if you don’t have the website, that’s able to convert them, then the client’s going to go away.  They’re going to be unhappy and go away anyway.  So then it all gets folded into like we’re responsible for all of this stuff.  So. 

Billy Gene·36:31

Yeah, because the client only pays for dollars, right?  Like in the marketing road and service, like, and you guys know this, but everyone listening, like, you know, I don’t care what rank you give them?  I don’t care how many clicks they got or how many comments or how viral it went that all the clients sees is how much they paid.  And if for anybody who’s like, yeah, but we got you ranked and dah, dah, if it was your business, how would you feel?  Cause you like it’s, this is the other part.  People forget as small business owners, most small business owners have about two weeks of runway.  Meaning if everything’s shut down and you couldn’t generate cash anymore, you got about two weeks to survive. 

Billy Gene·37:08

So you delivering to the client and you’re like, you just gotta be patient.  You can’t be patient.  Most people can’t.  And the funny thing is even the richest companies in the world and the fortune 500, most of them have about three and a half months of cash to actually float their companies.  Just think about that.  That’s these are the biggest companies in the world.  So people do not have time to wait.  They don’t have time to celebrate the things on our profit people.  Aren’t that excited about branding.  People are only excited about making more so that they can afford to do the other things. 

Matt Bertram·37:39

Th that, that is what we, when we bring people on and we train them, it’s like, you’re not doing SEO.  You’re not doing paid ads.  What you’re doing is you’re bringing in customers and you have to think about the business case of when you’re doing that.  Because honestly, when the client’s talking to you, all they’re trying to figure out is how much money you made me or how many customers you probably like in any metric you’ve given.  That’s literally like what they’re trying to figure out in anything that you give them. 

Billy Gene·38:04

And if you struggle with it, right, like it’s okay.  But just practice that.  That’s how you make more money.  Like, it just be honest with yourself.  Like, yeah.  I don’t know if I can do that for a client, then learn more skills.  Like that’s the switch, right?  It’s like, yeah.  You know, that’s when you go.  And that’s how I think a lot of people would just kind of started buying s**t is like, you know, first you learn WordPress.  And then you’re like, yeah, how do I people get people there.  Then you learn a little about SEO.  And you’re like, okay, this has taken a while.  How do I do some I about direct response?  You’re like, man, a lot of people aren’t buying right away. 

Billy Gene·38:36

Then you learn about follow-up emails.  And then you’re like, man, well, the emails are good, but nobody’s open to see. Now you’re doing follow up text messages.  And you’re like, man, I wish these people were buying from my website.  So now let me try a webinar to get a higher close percent.  Oh Jesus.  There’s still an 80% of the people that aren’t buying for this.  So don’t let me go on stage and close.  Well, wow.  How do I get more of those consistently and dah, dah.  And let me get some PR in there.  Well, it’s just, you know, you keep learning and you keep putting these skills. 

Billy Gene·38:58

And this is why when you know, when you sit down with the wisdom of someone who’s been in business for 50 years, you realize it just feels like that the smartest people ever, because they’ve just experienced the most.  And if the good ones they’ve continuously upgraded their skillset, and those are the winners.  I love that. 

Chris Burres·39:13

Absolutely true.  One of the things that you did talk about at affiliated Southwest and your, in your keynote speech was that a lot of people tend to stay away from sensitive topics like race, religion, politics, and you have more of like a Marine infantry man perspective, which is there’s a fire run to the fire.  Right?  Talk a little bit about that. 

Billy Gene·39:36

It’s the only thing that pays like right now, you know, anyone listening, go on your social media and post, you know, something gray, meaning you’re not siding on the left.  You’re not siding on the right.  You’re just like, Hey, I love everybody.  And everybody’s cool.  And you know, life is good and just be happy.  How could you be so blind to not see that? 

Chris Burres·39:57

I may be so polarizing right now? 

Billy Gene·40:02

I mean, just the greatest is not pay, you know, look at the end of the day, it’s like going back to that equation of how many people can you ask to buy?  Well, you know, if I post, if I spend a hundred bucks on a Facebook post and you know, a thousand people see it, well, I’m gonna get a thousand people to buy.  If I can spend a hundred bucks and a hundred thousand people see it tomorrow, when I have more chances to buy, what dictates that reach how entertaining your content is, period entertaining in the sense of the algorithm is very simply put likes comments shares and watch time likes common shares.  Watch time.  If you have that, it will reach more people.  So it’s cost effective to have timely, uncomfortable conversations.  Right? 

Billy Gene·40:45

So for example, most people are like, you know, I don’t want to talk about the election in my business because I don’t want to take a stand and it’s just too hot right now.  That’s fine.  You’re just going to be ignored.  You don’t have to talk about them, but no, one’s going to talk about you at all.  You ain’t gonna be in the conversation.  Right.  But you got to figure out how to insert yourself into the conversation because the reach is just so much more, 

Matt Bertram·41:10

Well, Joe Rogan does that and I know you do that is just following up. 

Billy Gene·41:13

Oh man, he’s got the biggest podcast in the world.  Mind you. 

Matt Bertram·41:17

All of the trends, right?  Like whatever anybody’s talking about, he jumps on that attention.  Find somebody interesting in that space and brings them in because people want to know about that.  Right.  And he’s like, here’s a bunch of content on it. 

Billy Gene·41:28

Yeah.  So, I mean like right now, for example, it’s every single day, just go to Google trends and just see what people are talking about.  And they just make content on that.  I mean, honestly, even if you’re not polarizing, if you just have an opinion on the hot thing, you were reached probably real number like 20 to 50 times more people, real number, you know?  And so when I look at that for the sake of money, I just don’t want to waste time talking about stuff that people don’t care about. 

Chris Burres·41:53

And you’ve given some good examples or at least at the talking some good examples about how your, you, you expressed an ability to address the sensitive topic, but not necessarily make a stand on it.  And then you, can you come up with any examples?  Do you happen to remember?  Cause I don’t think I remember. 

Billy Gene·42:14

I came up with yeah.  The idea of, I think, I dunno, I’ll just pull something out of my ass, right?  Like take Biden and Trump right now.  And a big topic is, you know, jobs, right.  Or let’s look, mask is very common right now.  I’m in California, San Diego, LA, I just went there mass mandate.  Right.  And it’s still, people are posting about it everyday. 

Matt Bertram·42:41

I’m sorry.  We’re in Texas.  There’s like, no, ma’am. 

Billy Gene·42:48

Right.  Correct.  Right.  So that would be the point though, is like running an ad in Southern California, you know?  And like I help entrepreneurs.  Right.  And so I’m saying like, can you guys believe all this nonsense that here we are again with a mass mandate when 49 other states don’t have it.  And the crazy thing is if you believe in mask, or if you don’t believe in mask, you still have to pay your bills in two weeks, you still got to do it.  So I’m bringing this up to say, what are you doing to actually grow your business right now?  Because whether you’re wearing a mask or not wearing a mask gas and electric is still do, whether you’re wearing a mask and not wearing a mask, you still got to pay your employees. 

Billy Gene·43:26

You guys get the point.  The only mask is over your eyes because you’re focused on the wrong things. Your family needs you to show up.  So come to this webinar, let me show you how to grow your business.  So you can stop masking.  What’s really going on with all this mass talk.  Right.  So that’s a perfect way of insulting my conversation without making an actual stand on, you know?  And that’s honestly, that’s usually where I sit, like people were saying polarizing, I don’t really ever have an opinion on anything, but if I, and if I do, I will talk s**t on all sides, I will make sure everyone’s equally offended.  It’s kind of like everyone. 

Matt Bertram·44:00

That’s perfect.  So I, you know what, I would love to make sure that we cover, cause I know our audience, you know, what is working today, right?  Like what are you seeing in the analytics?  Like, you know, how has things maybe shifted?  Like one of the things that I’ve found is when we’re running ads, typically stuff that worked great in the U S maybe six months ago works phenomenal in south America.  Right.  Great.  Now it’s like, you can almost predict the future, you know, to a certain degree based on the different kinds of ads that you run, but things are constantly changing opinion of safe stock art for one.  Right.  You know, or, you know, it like there’s just, there’s just constantly shifts. 

Matt Bertram·44:39

Certainly even this year on the SEO side of things, there’s ton of Google updates.  They mixed it up on everybody for sure.  And, you know, people constantly kind of evolve as they get more comfortable with the internet and have different opinions.  So I’m curious, kind of, you know, what are the things that you’re seeing?  Certainly like when the shift, the text messages that we started going to SMS where it’s 98%, nine, 9% open rates versus emails.  Like, I mean, that was like game changer for all of us back to the two S 2 cent, you know, Google ad words, right.  Like, 

Billy Gene·45:09

Yeah.  Yeah.  You know, I, I would say like for me is I try not to fall in love with any tool.  Right.  And your screwdriver, your hammer, your, your wrecking ball.  I mean, they’re all great depending on what the job is.  Right.  So that’s kind of how I figure, what if Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn tech talk, et cetera.  Like, what’s my job.  Are you telling me that I need to go, you know, sell something to teenagers?  Well, guess what the Tik TOK is going to be the best tool for the job.  But the one thing that they all share is messaging.  Like for any of them to work any of the tools, you have to have a message that people care about. 

Billy Gene·45:46

So to be honest with you, I spend personally like 99% of my time on that, you know, what am I going to say? That’s going to, because for example, at the end of the day, like I sell like marketing and helping businesses grow like in any economy you needed, et cetera, but it’s just easy to ignore at times.  And so, for example, when the pandemic first started happening, the big hook, the marketing message was if I had 30 days and I lost it all and I needed to figure out a way to get back.  And all I had was my cell phone and a laptop.  Here’s exactly what I would do to make 10,000 bucks.  That was my big pivot, everything else I did before that sucked to give numbers. 

Billy Gene·46:24

So, you know, before that were in the middle of promoting this thing about scaling your business and hiring more people.  When the pandemic hit, nobody was talking about that.  So, you know, we send an email, it’s like a million, people’s like three people are like, I’m interested, you know, probably selling mask or whatever. And then we switched the message to the 30 days, 10 grand who’s down to try it type of deal.  And then it’s like half a million dollars in sales right away, like literally zero to half a million take recently, you know, our message was, you know, s**t, oh, was the e-comm I did e-comm challenge was like, damn, you know, and again, the message is never like learn.  It’s like do it with me, watch her do it with me. 

Billy Gene·47:02

That is what sells in regards to coaching space, et cetera.  It’s do it with me.  So mine was, Hey, I’m going to do an e-com challenge.  Give me 90 days.  I’m going to start some e-commerce from scratch and f**k it.  I’m going to try and make a million bucks who wants to watch a quarter million bucks, three bucks, three days, boom, just like that.  Like, but it’s the hook. Now I share that because here’s the part that people don’t see.  It was the seven different hooks.  Before that I sent an email out to the same list that brought in $200 in imagine having massive brand, email us, et cetera.  And you send something that goes 200 bucks and we’re not dumb.  We took shots that we thought could be good.  Right. 

Billy Gene·47:39

But clearly were dumb.  You know what I mean?  Like it didn’t work.  So when we switched that hook to, oh, let’s put the e-comm spin on it.  We found a hot button.  People were crazy about the pandemics, which we found a hot button.  That message is universal.  Facebook, Instagram, YouTube link.  Don’t matter.  All the tools use the same thing to give perspective, like my most recent ad that’s by the way, giving me my lowest cost per lead in 12 years, you know? And it’s basically just me in a conference room and I have a bunch of flashcards and I, I bought a money counter thing that, you know, counts bills or whatever, 300 bucks at office Depot. 

Billy Gene·48:13

And I put the money in the beginning 30 to 3,200 bucks is how much 76% of Americans live on watch how fast I can spend it.  And I had flashcards rent, money car gas.  And I’m just spending all the money right there.  And then I just say, clearly you need to make more money.  If you need to learn how to, you know, some strategies on social media, click the button, let me show you that ad blows up.  And it gets us like, in some cases like 12 cent leads, I’m like, this is insane.  It goes nuts.  So then I get a message instagram, from the student with high school, with he’s like, yo, somebody stole your video on Tik TOK.  To be honest, I didn’t even look for like three days. 

Billy Gene·48:55

Cause I don’t care.  Cause I’m like, whatever that happens all the time, who cares.  But then I clicked the link randomly.  I don’t even know why.  And I go to it.  And that video that someone that Adam telling you about, they screen captured it, posted it on Tik TOK and put a bunch of hashtags.  It got 3 million views in three days organically.  Wow.  Now here’s the crazy thing I don’t have tick-tock. Tick-tock someone have it.  So, you know, now what did I do?  I’ve been call up the homies connection, like get me on Tik TOK.  I mean, how am I going to ignore it?  I went viral on Tik TOK.  I never used it before.  I don’t even know how to use the damn thing, you know? 

Billy Gene·49:30

So, but again, going with the tools, like I’m mad at myself for obviously being so exposed to tech talk and not testing it sooner.  How stupid, how ignorant it took somebody else testing my s**t for me without permission for me to take it seriously.  But man, I who would’ve known that message would have worked so good with that tool.  You know?  And I, here I am thinking it’s just a bunch of little kids, like who would care, but apparently 3 million of them, you know what I mean? 

Chris Burres·49:57

And there are some underlying themes here that I think are really important.  Cause we as marketers, it’s our job to ideation is a job, right?  That’s w that’s a big piece of the job.  And you talked about, you walked in and your team was like the Wolf of wall street video, man.  They weren’t feeling it.  And you just had a passion and you pushed through it.  Right.  And you were right.  And then you just talked about running, you know, X ads to your audience after they’ve experienced the brand and you generated $200 of sales and then you turn around and six figures.  Plus I don’t know.  I don’t remember the number. 

Chris Burres·50:31

There’s something interesting about marketing and maybe in comment about this, which is, you’ve got this passion for an idea and knowing when to let, like, we talk often at our offices, like, Hey, have a passion for your idea, defendant like defendant, like it’s your baby.  And then as soon as the data says, anything else was like that, apparently it wasn’t a baby like to talk, like it’s not my baby anymore because data is the baby talk about that and how that kind of works with. 

Billy Gene·51:03

It’s the only judge is the data.  Like, I mean, I really am a believer in like in life.  It’s just like, no one’s opinions matter.  Like there only isn’t there is not, you know what I mean?  Like you said, it is like, how good at marketing is the broken marketer?  How good like it?  And you just see it’s just so magical because even looking at how bad of a dilemma this is of, of people not paying attention to the numbers, it’s all the people right now who are Bitcoin experts, but are broke. All the people who are stock market experts, but are broke to me.  That is like the most offensive thing ever because of like, what do you mean?  Why didn’t you just make, you’re telling me what to do on money? 

Billy Gene·51:49

Why aren’t you rich?  They’re like, I’m certain, this is going to work.  I’m certain, this is the coin.  Why don’t you have a bazillion dollars then?  Because you literally just need to put your money there and do what you say.  And it will print out like right there.  Right?  So to me, even when I’m looking for help or a consultant, I want someone who has been there multiple times.  And I think this was big for hiring internally.  You know, you can interview with people and you’re like, you know, have you ever helped the kind of company you go to a hundred million before, you know, and some may say yes or 10 million or 10,000 or whatever. Have you ever closed somebody high ticket before?  Yeah, I’ve done that before. 

Billy Gene·52:23

And then there’s the people who have done it a hundred times.  You need to hire the, been there, been there the zillion times.  That is the most important aspect.  So even with, you know, ads or campaigns, I want something that’s worked a gazillion times for people.  I want results that have been tested in battle proven.  I want consultants who have been there, done that so many times.  And that’s how I hire.  So Krista answer your question and very long winded way of saying it.  There ain’t data behind it.  I do not care.  I just, I couldn’t care less. 

Chris Burres·52:57

Yeah, no.  I, I live in the car on the way to drop my kids off to school this morning, I was having a conversation about data on listening.  We’re listening to a podcast about happiness and my son chimed in with his opinion and like, no offense, but they told you the research data, they didn’t say, Hey, we asked a bunch of people.  What makes them happy?  And they said this, they actually did the research and they gave you the result.  So I have, again, I’ve used about things.  Then the data comes from like, oh, 

Billy Gene·53:28

And then, well, here’s the, and then here’s the other side of that though, right?  Is a lack of data.  Should also tell you that something is possible.  So you know what I mean?  So for example, if you’ve never tried something before then do not adamantly say that something won’t work and this is big with creatives, right?  It’s like, oh, you know, I don’t know if that would ever work.  Like we’ve never done that before.  Like I had a sales guy one time telling me I was like, what?  I was like, what I say?  I said, what’s your a sales go?  What the f**k was the conversation?  I’m sorry, I cussed.  I asked him, I said, what’s your, you know, I set a sales goal for him. 

Billy Gene·54:06

I said, your sales goal this month is 150,000 bucks for you personally.  And he said, why? And I said, you know, cause that’s the goal and you can do it.  And based on lead flow, like it’s 150,000 bucks.  And he said, yeah, but like, is that really fair?  And I’m like, fair.  First of all, that word, what does that mean?  Fair anyways, I just continue there.  And he goes, yeah.  I just think it’s like, why would you have that goal?  We’ve never done it before.  And he was so passionate about that.  Like, you don’t just make like, you haven’t done it before.  Why would you set that goal?  And I said, you know, well dude, like this entire company was created from a series of never done it before. 

Billy Gene·54:46

I’ve never made a hundred bucks.  I never made a thousand bucks.  I’ve never made 5,000, never made $5,000 in a day.  Never made 10,000, never made a hundred dollars.  Never made a million, never made 50 million.  Like I’ve never done any of this s**t before bro.  That’s the point.  I’ve never done it.  And I was like, your challenges right now is you think you can only do things that have been done and that’s why you’re stuck.  And that’s why I tell them, that’s why your performance is average because you’re having an average thought right now.  So I said, your goal is one 15.  You’re going to beat it and you need to believe that and f*****g get it done.  So we did $169,000 the next month. 

Billy Gene·55:23

And I told him, Hey, remember that forever.  I don’t even care if you work here or not.  I want you to remember that forever, because if you can get what just happened in that moment, you can do anything you want in life. 

Chris Burres·55:36

But mentor. 

Billy Gene·55:39

A little bit.  I don’t know if he’s happy, but when he made the 169 grand, it had a big check.  He was happy then. 

Matt Bertram·55:45

And you know, Chris, you speak about this stuff a lot.  Like the law of deservedness.  So basically Billy just shared kind of blog deserving.  If you want to kind of, I know people like want just actionable steps on this, but. 

Chris Burres·55:59

Yeah, 

Matt Bertram·56:00

Like, I mean, a lot of art, a lot of marketing is mindset.  I can do this or I’m going to try it.  I’m going to be bold enough.  Or, you know, I’m going to put in the work, like have the work ethic to do it.  Right.  But Chris, you talk about law deserving.  This, that was probably one of the, when we linked up, that was probably one of the first things that you talked about.  And I think Billy kind of said it in a different light or David an example, or. 

Chris Burres·56:22

Maybe you share that.  Yeah, I, I think, and there’ll be a good, this will have a good question for you, Billy.  So the law of just a friend of mine coined the phrase, a law of deservingness and it says that you have today, everything that you truly believe you deserve, or you don’t have today, everything you truly believe, you don’t believe, truly believe you don’t deserve.  If you get more than you truly, and we’re talking like we’re not talking, like, do I deserve the Lamborghini we’re talking about, do I really deserve the Lamborghini?  And if you get more than you truly deserve, you’ll at a minimum, not enjoy it or most likely sabotage it. 

Chris Burres·57:00

So your business model in, in the coaching framework and I’ve had conversations with other, just kind of not marketing coaches, but business coaches is very unique because these people are already pushing their limit, right? Like they’re doing the best they can when they come to you.  And so I, I’ve got to imagine that you see regularly, especially on these weekly coaches where you’re like, Hey, just go spend 20 minutes and make a Facebook ad.  And here’s the text or what, like, you guys get pretty specific about it.  And then seven days later, they come back and it’s not done.  And there’s got to be part of your team’s like what?  Like what do we do about that? 

Chris Burres·57:42

And, and I do believe what’s happened is they’ve got this law of deservedness this Darren Hardy calls it a step point.  They’re already at their set point and they come to you, right.  They’re already the kind of person who’s trying to push their set point.  And then the first thing you do is make a good ad and push them beyond their set point, which is amazing.  Have you thought about like how much mindset work you do with customers?  Is that, and have you seen that artifact with your customers? 

Billy Gene·58:12

Every single call I have, we start with the core values of a genius number.  Zero is everything is my fault.  You know, we don’t make excuses.  We make it happen.  Right.  Learn something new every day and apply it.  We are here to serve selflessly with integrity.  It’s, you know, I got 14 of these things that we say every single time, because it’s the whole thing.  Like, it’s the, I mean, no, actually I’m going to say the back, I’m going to correct myself. 

Billy Gene·58:35

It’s 50% of the thing, you know, and a lot of people with some dope mindsets that ain’t doing s**t and they need to , it’s 50, you know, you got to have both, but I will tell you, I’ve seen a very rarely, I don’t know if I could, matter of fact, actually, I’ll sit here and say this, and I’m sure you guys have, you know, Medica Zen, you guys are successful.  You Madigan’s zillion successful people.  And so vine, I have never met a very successful person who doesn’t work on their mindset or credit it to that or mentor coach ever in my entire existence.  Ooh, that’s good.  I’m going to use that for an acting note that Paul really not a single one, not what can you guys real talk like anyone? 

Chris Burres·59:21

I think you know, I always say this is that I’ve met people I’m less into like in my humble or not.  So humble opinion in this case, less intelligent than me that are more financially successful.  And that was the measure that I was using.  And then I’ve met people significantly more intelligent than me and less financially successful.  And so that really, again, boils down to the set point.  Like you don’t have to be the sharpest tack in the box to be really successful.  You’ve just got to do the, and frankly, I often say like, success is born out of really boring stuff now, and we’re in marketing. 

Chris Burres·01:00:00

And so like, we get the really fun part of it, but it is coming up and like you’re saying 80 per 80 plus percent of your time is thinking about the next campaign.  That means you’re doing the same thing all the time, but it’s the thing that’s worked to get you here.  And there’s the thing that is working to get you there.  It’s the same damn thing.  Like find the thing that’s working and keep doing the same damn thing over and over again.  So yeah, 

Billy Gene·01:00:25

I got to remind myself even times because you know, in this position I’m particularly in right now, I get so many investment opportunities, et cetera.  And some of them I dive into and then, you know, I have many conversations with myself with like, Billy, you just make a new video ad in a new VSL, like Just make a new he’s doing like, you know what I mean?  So I knew that lack of every single time I’ve stuck with the fundamentals, but then gotten better at the fundamentals as we grow as a company spot. 

Matt Bertram·01:00:56

So Billy, I’m going to switch gears a little bit honest here.  So are you going to be the next marketer to jump into the crypto bandwagon and started seeing just so many partners? 

Billy Gene·01:01:08

No, I like, look, I’ve only taught one thing for 12 years, customer acquisition.  I’ve never stopped my, I I’ve beat on that drum till the end.  And you know, sometimes the tools to get that done changes and I’ll be an advocate for those things and I’ll learn new things.  And obviously that the process of learned how to build an organization and dope things.  But no, I don’t know anything about crypto, so I would never teach anything.  I don’t know about.  I’m the first guy to say, I don’t know.  People ask me course on calls all the time.  So Billy, what do you think about like, people ask me SEO questions, Billy, what do you think?  I said no f*****g clue.  I don’t know. Exactly. 

Billy Gene·01:01:44

I couldn’t even begin to tell you know, so with crypto, no, I, I wouldn’t, you know, a hundred percent, but what I find like, so for example, I’m like, I’m big on trust.  I don’t trust anybody.  Like I don’t rock with anybody.  I’m just like, I don’t trust anybody because a lot of people die and they’re full of it, but whatever that’s I digress.  However, I do know some wildly successful people in crypto and at firsthand gotten to see them do it.  I’ve seen them stay true for the last six years in consistency.  Would I be open to introducing my audience to a joint thing where I say, but my message would be this, Hey guys, I know nothing crypto.  I wish I knew more. 

Billy Gene·01:02:20

I don’t want to be the idiot sitting on the sidelines or the arrogant fool, not paying attention.  So I have a buddy coming to talk to me about it.  If you want to come with me, we can learn this together.  That is a finesse that I would work with.  And then I get to learn.  And then my people want to rock with me too.  They can, but my vetting process crazy.  I don’t like, yeah, they’d be legit is as it comes, you know, 

Billy Gene·01:02:42

Brand is only, 

Matt Bertram·01:02:43

And I was certainly saying that a little bit tongue and cheek, because I’ve just started to see me a lot of marketers, like the videos, right.  Have just started to kind of grab that. 

Billy Gene·01:02:53

That’s the example that Chris gave her, like, okay, if you’re that nice and crypto show me the receipts, like soda receipts.  And then also show me the history.  I want to see your track record, print it out.  Like there’s no.  So, you know, people always say, how do you know if someone’s telling the truth or not check the receipts?  Yeah.  Check of the receipts and then ask other people what they think about them. 

Matt Bertram·01:03:14

That, that blockchain is a distributed ledger and it’s immutable.  And. 

Billy Gene·01:03:25

Also to people like, you know, this is what people don’t realize about crypto is like, is I stay objective to realize that crypto could continue to blossom and be the biggest thing.  But I’m also aware enough.  Like, you’ll see some people who are like, it’s the future.  And you’re an idiot.  If you don’t understand.  I’m also aware that the biggest threat to crypto that everybody’s sleeping on right now in my humble opinion is the metaverse.  Because if people do get into the metaverse and as many users, the 3 billion that are on Facebook, if they all go into the metaverse and then the metaverse says, this is the formal currency to buy things and virtual reality, which is a metaverse, but Facebook owns the people. 

Billy Gene·01:04:03

It will be a threat to crypto immediately because people will be buying in game things, just a different thought, right? Like, or as you can see with government regulation, someone gets in there and one thing goes there and here’s the biggest one.  This is my favorite one is people go, you can’t hack crypto.  It can never be wrong.  And I can’t wait.  I can’t, oh, I should take this back.  Cause I don’t wish ill on anybody, but we’ll have the conversation where it’s like, oh, is crypto even safe anymore?  And then it’s going to be the conversation of like, well, you have to be smart with it because it needs to be in this type of wallet in this.  And then the conversation will keep going. 

Billy Gene·01:04:38

Like, it’s just, my point is like have the humility as I challenged everyone.  Cause I was really bad at the beginning of my career, have the humility to realize that none of us know what’s going to be, but have the skills to be equipped.  So when it does happen, we can jump right on it.  And something’s here consistently.  No. 

Chris Burres·01:04:58

So in a, in one of the interviews that I looked up, you were called a marketing genius and maybe that happens all the time.  If you’re writing the scripts, that should happen more often.  Right. 

Billy Gene·01:05:11

I put it all over our branding.  So it should be said. 

Chris Burres·01:05:16

So it was Damon John, when you interviewed with him in any show to book and I have to, there was no discussion of the story behind it.  And I’m assuming there is related to the book.  Like you send him a book and can you talk about, is the restorative behind that first off?  And then, 

Billy Gene·01:05:35

I mean, I’m in one of his books, he wrote about one of his books. 

Chris Burres·01:05:38

So it could be so like, it would be aspirational to, to be on an app to get interviewed by Daymond.  John I’ve seen him talk, obviously watched shark tank.  Was there a process for that relationship or. 

Billy Gene·01:05:50

Yeah, big process.  I’ll tell you about that.  One thing I want to acknowledge, like for example, my branding is marketing genius.  Like I don’t think I’m a genius at all.  I think I have so much to learn.  I think the version of me today is laughable relative to creating, but putting in the work, still studying, et cetera.  So like, I think I’m like this, this amount of smart and marketing relative to what I know, like, you know what I mean?  The weaknesses.  So it’s more of a branding play, right?  My name is Billy Jean.  So it’s easy to genius.  But when I use the word genius, I’m actually calling it to my community to talk about mindset is to give them confidence, right? 

Billy Gene·01:06:26

Because if somebody calls you a genius, you’d be flattered and you believed that you could do things that you maybe couldn’t do. So if I can call all my community geniuses, you’re a genius.  You’re a genius.  Your genius.  When maybe everybody else is calling them dumb, ignorant, stupid, blah, blah.  It can give them a little hype.  So that’s where the genius thing comes from.  But going with the Damon thing, you know, and just meeting people well, app advertising is the, I think it’s just like the secret weapon that everybody sleeps on.  And here’s what I mean, advertising is amazing because if it doesn’t work, you can stop it immediately and change it the next day.  Just imagine sitting at like a blackjack table where you have infinity money that you can make. 

Billy Gene·01:07:05

But if you’re about to lose a big hand, you can hold up to these chips back and not bet that’s how advertisements.  So when I think of it like that, I’m like, this is crazy that people aren’t doing it, but also every single time, the time that you’re advertising.  And in my case, when I’m advertising, if it doesn’t work, I don’t do it.  But if it does work, it means I’m making a profit, which means I’m getting paid to be seen.  I’m getting paid to build a freaking brand.  So with that, wait s**t, go back to your quote.  Hold on.  You said something. So through becoming known, et cetera, and then also building distribution, creating a massive email list. 

Billy Gene·01:07:44

I have a trade that is worth it to an employer, which is I can push their products or services, right.  Because of the relationship built through advertising and the distribution collected through advertising.  So Damon had a book coming out.  I think it was his first, like the power Brooke, like years back.  And I saw that and I always been watching him on shark tank.  And at this point I was doing speaking already and things of that nature.  And we had mutual friends.  So I was like a degree away from him, but we never really connected.  So I was sick of like missing the opportunity to like meet him through people and s**t.  And I hate depending on people for anything.  Cause I have trust issues, like I said, so that’ll be. 

Chris Burres·01:08:23

One of the takeaways. 

Billy Gene·01:08:25

I went, I went to his website and like, and I just put in a message.  I just said, Hey, my name is Billy.  You know, my ads have been seeing this time an entrepreneur, I have this big of an email list.  I saw that Damon’s has a book coming out.  I would love to promote it simple.  Right.  And I knew that message was going to go to his team and what I try to think of myself as like, whoever gets this message, how can I make them look good?  And they’re going to look good if they’re pushing his book and coming with a new revenue, like that’s cool.  So I put it in there.  I was like, I’ll probably never hear anything back.  But I was like, I can’t sleep at night. 

Billy Gene·01:09:01

I might as well send it.  I got a reply that was like, Hey, Damon’s actually interested.  And then he did a vet and was able to verify me through some other mediums, et cetera.  And so his guy test out at to Ted hits me and was like, Hey, we’re going to be in town for this event.  I don’t remember what it was.  Maybe was CNC or something.  And my office is down the street from all of that.  And so I said, cool, I’ll send him a limo.  I sent him a limo to come to the office.  And so long story short pay grace. 

Billy Gene·01:09:29

And I’m like, oh s**t. 

Billy Gene·01:09:32

But I also had to promise that I was going to like deliver and sales.  Like my audience will buy a book.  Does that sound like, gosh, s**t.  I hope this works.  Right.  So anyways, actually I tell my story about Damon.  First time Damon came into the office.  So my team is a young, more upbeat.  And when people come to the office, we have their picture up.  We like celebrate.  This is like a big deal.  Right?  So he comes in and he opens the door and he sees the whole team.  They’re like, Hey.  And he shuts it like a step back.  Like if you’re about to walk into somewhere and then is, has got Chauncey helps him with marketing, but looks like a scary guy is massive. 

Billy Gene·01:10:09

Opens the door again.  And they come through and we walk them and now it’s kind of awkward and s**t. And he’s just like, and he’s like sign man.  Like I just, you know, we don’t know each other yet.  Right.  Like who knows what’s going to happen in that room?  Like he could be walking into whatever the f**k.  Right.  So he steps back.  So anyways, me and him go upstairs and we’re about if we can do this, like interview content creation thing.  And I was like, Hey man, we got you this.  And on his Instagram, he always gives out dad, he’s always telling stupid dad jokes, m**********r.  He always told jokes. 

Billy Gene·01:10:40

And so we got him a dad joke book and we highlighted all the funniest ones and he starts dying, laughing.  And he’s like, yo, this is a great gift.  And then this was a funny story is my, you know, my ex girl was there with there at the time.  And she upstairs, he’s like, oh, this s**t girl, hi, nice to meet you. Nice to meet you too.  It was like, wow.  We both like dad jokes.  And we’re both dating white girls.  I three, we just laughed.  And it just kind of like broke the awkwardness.  And then we did content together and we did like a joint, like little 30 minute presentation that we ended up doing this a webinar.  And obviously I brought my a game. 

Billy Gene·01:11:15

I got to demonstrate to him my skillset during that.  And like we vibed.  But anyways, we also ended up doing like 50,000 bucks, like 30, 40, 50, something like that, like right away.  And you know, think about it.  It’s like someone like Kim’s getting pitched all the time.  Everyone talks about what they can do.  I’m like not come here, I’ll make it happen.  Done.  And it was down the street.  30 minutes of his time, I showed him a horrible, you know, a high ROI. And then this was my Jew.  This was years ago now. 

Billy Gene·01:11:40

So years later that we just became friends, like especially clubhouse, we really got to link up, you know, like just talking shop and then, you know, out in New York, matter of fact, I just actually did the, he did like an internal team meeting for his shark group.  And I got to go in there as a guest to last month, but anyways, full circle.  So that was a very long story.  Sorry.  And I just think it’s interesting how all that s**t actually comes into play.  And then it’s the domino effect, right?  Like once you know, people and then it’s just, yeah.  So that was that. 

Chris Burres·01:12:12

Yeah.  No, it’s it.  I figured there was some kind of longer story behind it.  And then the dad joke in that interview, you said that you were going to grab one day.  I don’t know if you had a particular dad joke that you pulled up.  Did you ever pull one up?  I think the, at least the piece I saw ended before you got to share your dad joke. 

Billy Gene·01:12:32

I don’t remember what it was, David.  David’s better at dad jokes.  I’m more better at an inappropriate jokes that we can’t tell them about podcast. 

Chris Burres·01:12:42

So, so one of the things that I want to share, like we talked about kind of heavy hitting stuff, like being able to deliver some value and we haven’t actually gotten that technical, but I think this has been really our, and I think this has been really. 

Billy Gene·01:12:55

Valuable. 

Chris Burres·01:12:57

Yeah.  Is that Damon? 

Billy Gene·01:13:04

Sorry.  Sorry guys. 

Chris Burres·01:13:05

Is you, and you talked about this at ASW.  There were some very specific kind of Facebook type campaigns and maybe you want to share something different, but I just wanted to kind of lead.  You not just throw you into the fire.  Like I did earlier, 

Billy Gene·01:13:24

Like. 

Chris Burres·01:13:26

Run us through some ideas that you have for Facebook campaigns that are like different, 

Billy Gene·01:13:31

Easy. 

Chris Burres·01:13:31

Yeah, yeah, 

Billy Gene·01:13:32

Yeah.  Everybody, especially like these are good ones, a couple with like SEO, right?  That’s SEO podcasts.  Like, you know, one of the challenges with SEO is just the, it takes time, right?  So educating and I’m preaching to the choir here.  So there’s that, but one way to earn business with an easy win, without getting hardcore into the direct response advertising world, you know, is just running simple birthday ads on campaigns, on Facebook advertising to people with an upcoming birthday, it’s literally a click of a button.  You can spend five, 10 bucks a day.  But if you’re doing SEO for like, you know, a restaurant or something like that, it’s a very simple of, Hey, let me buy your beer.  We see your birthday’s coming up, come on in. 

Billy Gene·01:14:14

And it’s just something where the client can go.  Wow.  As a result of hiring you, I am seeing traction and the message that you hear a lot of the time is I hired a marketing guy and I didn’t see a single lead.  And now you’re like, wow, a couple of days of working with you, same day of working with you.  I’m getting it.  That’s how I gotten all the orange three Fitnesses is speed.  You know, cause a lot of them were doing SEO and I was like, I know this Facebook thing and you know, and six hours I’d bring them 20 leads.  And it’s like tie went viral within their franchise and ended up working with 300 other locations. 

Matt Bertram·01:14:44

I like that late wait, late.  Let’s start wrapping up Chris.  And maybe. 

Chris Burres·01:14:49

You mentioned orange theory.  My friend Patrick, who kind of coined the phrase law of deservedness is, has done training with them kind of at the corporate level. 

Billy Gene·01:14:58

It. 

Chris Burres·01:14:58

Was right before pre right before a pandemic.  So that’s kind of fallen off and it will probably be picking up, but it’s kind of cool.  Cool. 

Billy Gene·01:15:05

Yeah, that was like, when I was really popping with, it was probably like 2015, 16, maybe 17. 

Chris Burres·01:15:11

Matt, do you have a kind of wrap up questions?  I’ve got, well, I’ve kind of got one last one.  If. 

Matt Bertram·01:15:16

No, no, I just, you know, I, I love just, you know, hidden with some tactics, right?  Like just ending with just some different tasks. 

Billy Gene·01:15:23

No, that’d be one thing.  Boom.  Face.  Yes.  The facebook ad a hundred percent like try that.  Do it anniversaries.  I mean the birthday, one thing, anniversaries, upcoming anniversaries, everyone should be taking advantage of that because that’s when men are willing to spend.  And so our women to have the perfect date night.  So be creative thinking about it also too, with the birthday ones.  Even with like insurance companies, it’s a good way to get insurance leads.  Hey, you just turned 40.  You got to start thinking about other things now, retirement, financial planning, et cetera.  There’s just a big opening for symbol direct response ads that work because of someone’s birthday.  And they’re paying attention to someone says happy birthday.  Like they feel that right. 

Billy Gene·01:16:00

That people like to be cared about.  Other things too is while they’re traveling simple ones, right?  You know, on Facebook you can click a button and advertise to people based on if they are traveling in a location, that’s a great way to get tourist money, et cetera. If you’re dealing with any service-based businesses, Hey, while you’re in San Diego, come here and stop by while you’re in Texas, come here and dah, dah.  So just, and these are all things that you just go on.  The backend of Facebook, click a button can spend five to 10 bucks, write a basic ass message like I’m freestyling right here and get results.  And this is how the client sees his results to bring sales in other things than that. 

Billy Gene·01:16:37

With webinars, if anybody’s selling via webinars, I will tell you, we are seeing a lot of success with zoom.  And in particular, I’ve done all the softwares that automate your webinars.  I can’t stand them all.  They always break.  I don’t know what’s going on.  Or show rates sucks.  The conversions are low.  So what we’ve found a lot of success in is running Encore, presentations of a zoom, and then just playing the video through zoom. And in particular, I love zoom, et cetera.  Another random tip zoom phone.  If everyone’s not using it for the internal team, people with bigger teams here, it’s amazing.  Like right now, if I pick up my cell phone, I can go to zoom phone and it is different. 

Billy Gene·01:17:17

It is not the same as your regular zoom account, but I can click zoom.  I can go phone.  I can see right now a list of every single person in my company.  And there’s a little ear logo that shows up and I can press a button.  I can listen to all their conversations in one place I can barge in.  I can take over the call.  I can see how many minutes.  And it’s such this it’s a crazy symbol.  Userface you literally hit zoom, press phone.  And you can see all that instant access. This is great.  If you’re training a sales team, if you want to see what they’re saying and the favorite side of it is it’s really cheap, but they also have a whisper mode in there. 

Billy Gene·01:17:49

So if somebody is on the phone with a sales client, you can hit whisper and they can hear me, but the client can not seem to do real-time coaching.  And it’s the best phone service.  That’s actually not delayed.  Sometimes when you do like other services like this, like monitor for business, there’s a very big delay.  Zoom, no delay.  I can not say enough.  Good things about the zoom phone in particular, and everyone should look into it and use it.  That’s not an affiliate deal.  Just genuinely thrilled as a customer.  I wish I found it sooner, even works great for a student, you know, customer service, other things that are working. 

Billy Gene·01:18:24

I’m just always a proponent of thinking of physical s**t that you can give what the cell I talked about the USBs, but if you have courses or something like definitely make sure you have a guide, right?  Give away the course for free, but you can actually sell the guy like the pronounceable is absolutely massive.  We’ve been going hard on the certification.  Just the positioning of the certification is amazing and renting out a stadium for the graduates.  That has been massive one because it shows how much you give a damn about your people.  But the other thing too is only 175,000 bucks.  Now, remember this is a kid whose parents both grew up on welfare.  I know $175,000 is not a little money, but relative to an event to give you guys perspective. 

Billy Gene·01:19:04

Like when you put on 500 people at an event in a hotel, that bill is probably going to cost you two 50 to three, you know, with a V and all this stuff.  It’s so it’s ridiculous.  So anybody who’s in that event space really check out stadiums for graduation.  It was way cheaper.  They had fireworks included, et cetera.  And the content from leveraging and running out that space is amazing.  It’s like, look, what we do for it was just crazy now.  So that was actually a surprising cost.  How has the stadium cheaper than damn hotels with s**t?  You know what I mean?  It didn’t make any sense to me.  So that’s another big thing and damn, I’m trying to think. 

Chris Burres·01:19:39

Let’s get one last question.  And then we’ll, you can tell everybody how to make contact with you.  You probably have some free giveaway in your back pocket somewhere, for sure.  What are your marketing pet peeves? 

Billy Gene·01:19:56

I mean, my biggest one is just boring.  Like it, because it’s so expensive and it doesn’t work like it.  I really believe it’s a requirement to be entertaining and like to get somebody to do anything profitably in the world of online advertising or this online world.  Like, so my biggest pet peeve is when I see something and it’s just like, or it’s like, dude, you don’t even talk like this.  It’s like, I know you don’t, you don’t it’s the persona that I don’t want to call it a pet peeve because I get it.  And I understand that people come to it, but it’s like, you don’t like people create a persona of who they think people want them to be when they come online, especially when they start doing video. 

Billy Gene·01:20:39

And it’s because were trained that way.  Because in the beginning you always saw people in suits talking like this and perfect pose, you know, like, and it’s just nonsense these days.  So that’s one thing that I think people could. 

Chris Burres·01:20:51

Very cool.  All right.  How can our audience connect with you and get something free?  I, and I’m just, I’m throwing that out there.  If there’s nothing free.  I apologize. 

Billy Gene·01:21:02

I believe we have good.  All my courses.com.  I’ll make sure after this, Hey, somebody out there, I don’t know if anyone’s. 

Chris Burres·01:21:11

Going to hear me, but all my courses. 

Billy Gene·01:21:13

Is get all my courses.  Can you ask marketing is get all my courses active for all of our, what?  Where does someone go to get all our s**t for free?  What Is it?  It may not be for free on there right now.  Yeah. 

Chris Burres·01:21:25

It may not be for free.  It feels like free given the value. 

Billy Gene·01:21:28

It is, but I’ll do something for your group where, you know, I can update you guys and give you a domain or they can get all our shifts. 

Chris Burres·01:21:35

And then I’m there.  Get all my courses set you up.  Like that’s not fair. 

Billy Gene·01:21:39

Yeah.  I think you guys get all my courses.com.  If it’s not free, it’s basically for free and that’s for real, a decade worth of content.  We’re good.  We’re good.  Yeah.  It’s for real, a, a decade worth of content, like high ticket stuff, like private interviews.  It’s like, it is the best deal on the internet.  Like I’m not even playing like just go get it. 

Chris Burres·01:21:59

It’s 97 bucks or at least that’s what’s at the top.  And there’s like. 

Matt Bertram·01:22:03

One client young client, right.  To ROI, positive ROI. 

Billy Gene·01:22:08

You have to not like get a stupid RR and that you have to like, come, you have to burn it.  You have to get it and then burn it digitally.  You have to. 

Chris Burres·01:22:19

Buy it three more times. Well, Billy Jean man, this has been absolutely amazing.  I’m glad that really it was Matt and the team kind of got on the bandwagon.  Kind of understood who you were shared it with me.  I, we bumped into each other at affiliate Southwest.  It’s been such an honor to have you on the podcast.  We really appreciate it again for all those who are listening, get all my courses.com.  You can go get Billy Jean stuff.  It’s only 97 bucks invest in yourself.  I think that’s one of the takeaways from this podcast, invest in yourself.  The people who are investing in themselves are more successful.  And I think we can say what we said earlier as the opposite. 

Chris Burres·01:23:00

Those who are successful are always investing themselves a hundred percent.  So thanks for tuning in until the next podcast.  My name’s Chris Burris.  My name is Matt Bertram and that is Billy.  Gene is marketing.  Really?  I appreciate you.  Thank you.  Bye-bye for now.  Thanks a lot.