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Geofencing Tips For Retailers To Deliver Targeted Advertising
In this last episode of 2018, join industry experts, Chris and Matt as they discuss different ways for retailers to deliver targeted advertising using geofencing. Featuring “6 geofencing tips for retailers to deliver targeted advertising” by Preetham Venkatesh. TRANSCRIPT:

Chris: Hi and welcome to the SEO Podcast: Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing. My name is Chris Burres, owner of eWebResults.

Matt: My name is Matt Bertram, your SEO MMA champion!

Chris: SEO MMA champion! I like that. We did have to be a little bit careful when we did a punch in the face earlier because we have an MMA guy kind of connected in– it’s a good thing.

Matt: It’s a good thing.

Chris: It’s a good thing, right?

Matt: It’s okay, yup.

Chris: It’s always– it’s the most fun when people from kind of New York call and like, “Do you listen to the podcast?” Like yeah, how many have you listened to? Because if it’s one or two, you won’t want to like jump into punch in face. “Oh, I’ve listened to like four or five.” Oh, then I can say punch in the face comfortably. Literally if they’re from New York, they’re still very uncomfortable. When you say punch in face, it’s like, “Hah, yeah. No, that’s great. That’s in your podcast. It’s your stick.” So welcome to another fun-filled podcast, fun-filled episode. This is Episode #444. And as ways we have– well, we don’t have a tip today but we do have a review. And this is one of those reviews– I can’t remember where I picked up this review.

Matt: Oh, I’m looking at the Burger King menu.

Chris: You have the Burger–

Matt: I was like, “This is the review?”

Chris: We’re going to talk about geofencing today. So that’s pretty exciting, but this review really had three questions of somebody. His name is Gennady Kolodenker, right? Punch in the face to you Gennady. And it says, “What did you like best?” And this is about eWebResults, it says, “Honest, knowledgeable, easy to talk to, knows what they are talking about. Results were seen very fast for me, very helpful for organic, natural SEO.” What did you like least? “There is nothing that I could say for this section.” That’s pretty awesome. “Describe your overall experience? Fantastic experience. My bounce rate for my site dropped from 66% to 33% in 3 days.” Excuse me, that’s from 66% to 33% in just three days. Amazing. “The advice give is honest and so super helpful. I have a list of at least 15 things I need to work on to improve my website. I try, I do a little every day. Thanks for the advice guys.” Punch in the face to you Gennady.

Matt: He’s a foot doctor.

Chris: Oh, he’s a foot doctor.

Matt: He’s a podiatrist out in California. So we’re really starting to get a get a lot of reviews in this format of, “Hey, I have too many leads. How do I manage these leads? How do I filter the leads?” Really that’s step 2, right? So it’s getting you the leads and then it’s filtering through the leads. And we’re having client after client asking us. I actually had someone say we need to pause the SEO before we start a different theme because I got to figure out how to handle all the phone calls.

Chris: Yup. So three come to mind: I need to pause the SEO before we go on to the next kind of subject matter in it. I think that was probably an attorney, right?

Matt: Yes.

Chris: And so we’ll get back to you when we’re able to handle what we know you’re going to send us. Right? Right?

Matt: Yeah, yeah.

Chris: What was the next one? The next one–

Matt: Oh, that was today.

Chris: Yeah. So the next one that was–

Matt: So it was up in New York.

Chris: Oh, it was up in New York? Tell me a little bit about that one.

Matt: So essentially there’s different services she offers – it’s like a nail salon place – and basically she told us to turn them off because it’s too many.

Chris: Yup.

Matt: I mean we got a call from–

Chris: And she said, “I need a system in place to handle all these leads.”

Matt: Yeah, yeah.

Chris: So she went from pre-eWebResults: no system in place was plenty, she could handle the leads, not a problem. Post-eWebResults: now she needs a system. So we’ve actually got to put together a quote to get to her on like, “Here’s what you need to do with these leads that are coming in that you’re so busy you can’t answer the phone for.” Yeah.

Matt: Yeah. No, there’s definitely a couple scenarios in which these sort of things are pretty commonplace. Got another client, a franchisee, got on the phone with the major franchise–

Chris: That was the other one I was thinking, yeah.

Matt: Okay, we got quite a few. But let’s go on.

Chris: So you started with the franchisee and then the franchise–

Matt: Was like, “What are you y’all doing?” Because each lead was worth $18,000. We had 183 onsite tours, which those convert into $18,000 over the course of a year. And we got him two last week. Alright? And so the marketing is like exponential, but I mean it’s really–

Chris: It’s great!

Matt: Yeah, it’s great, but we can talk about all that later.

Chris: We are going to talk about geofencing today. If this is the first time you’ve visited the podcast: Howdy, and welcome to the podcast. If you’ve come back to this podcast, you might be interested in some of the tips that we have. So you could go to, or you can click mini-mags or mini-guides. Mini Guides!

Matt: Resources, yeah. Yeah, yeah.

Chris: Yeah, Resources and Mini Guides.

Matt: And we’ve actually started to build a lot of tools. We have a domain authority checker. We have a Word Counter and we have a Word Combiner. We’re continuing to build little tools on our website. Definitely go check them out. We’re playing around with them, we’ll be adding more soon.

Chris: And if you want to leave us a review, first: we would really appreciate it. You can go to Upcity included us as one of the Top 5 SEO Companies So another review there could be really beneficial, we would appreciate it.

Matt: Yeah, and I think Clutch named us like top Full Service Agency for 2018. So, yeah.

Chris: Boom! That is good. Alright teaser article.

Matt: I want to talk about hamburgers and McDonald’s Chris!

Chris: Alright, so you may be aware of the Burger King– so we’re going to talk about “6 Geofencing Tips for Retailers to Deliver Targeted Advertising.” And I figured we should tie this in with this really great geofencing campaign that’s going on right now. Burger King is calling it the Whopper Detour, only available at McDonald’s.

Matt: They’re getting aggressive.

Chris: So there’s actually a news camera– newscast and the camera is there at McDonald’s and people are going through the McDonald’s line going, “Yeah, I want the Whopper Deal.”

Matt: No way.

Chris: Yes. Yes.

Matt: That is awesome.

Chris: Because the way this works is basically: Burger King came out with a way that you can place orders online, right?

Matt: Ah-ha.

Chris: Fast food restaurant, it’s not McDon– like I’m not– like I’m sure there’s a bunch of them out there that are doing it. I’m just not aware of it. Maybe even McDonald’s has been doing it for a long time, just not aware of it. Burger King was like, “Not only are we going to do it now, we’re also going to make sure everybody knows about it.” So literally you have to get their app – You have to have their app on your phone – you have to be near a McDonald’s. Their app will geofence you and know that you’re near the McDonald’s, will pop up and say, “Get your one cent hamburger: follow these directions.” And give you directions to the Burger King where you can get your one cent hamburger.

Matt: Yeah, no I mean there’s so much fun stuff that we’re doing with beacons.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: We actually are in talks. We’re going through all the red tape with a pretty large community college and we’re going to be building beacons on multiple floors. So if they go in the Financial Aid section– okay? So they’ll get ads and–

Chris: They’ll get an app, yeah.

Matt: We can start tracking where people are going in an open house through kind of heat maps and IP addresses. And you know, really even I got right now a plastic surgeon that is just really, really analytical, and is tracking all his leads. And I said, “Well, you’re getting the form submissions, you’re getting the phone calls. you’re getting the downloadables, but what about when they walk into your clinic? The foot traffic?” Right?

Chris: Right.

Matt: And so we were talking about setting that up for them. And then we have a car dealership right now that we’re only doing the showroom floor, but there’s an opportunity to even close the loop, okay? As far as when a goal is set for when they test drive a car. So you can get from whatever cars you sit in, to be able to test drive it.

Chris: Specific ads.

Matt: Specific ads, yeah. So there’s a lot of fun stuff. I was talking to the owner of the Rolls-Royce dealership at this event, and the marketing lady that’s big time out in–

Chris: I saw a picture of you in front of the Rolls, how did that Rolls look?

Matt: It was nice, but I was talking to him about it and the marketing lady, who does all their marketing, was like staring at me and like she had her arms crossed. And I know her, I know her socially and she was not happy I was there.

Chris: That true?

Matt: But I was like– I wasn’t there for– I’m not here to–

Chris: I’m not trying to steal your business or put you out of work.

Matt: Yeah, I was just talking about stuff that’s cool.

Chris: Just do your job. Right, so this is, “6 Geofencing Tips for Retailers to Deliver Targeted Advertising.” This is by Preetham Venkatesh. It is a short article. Really, I’m going to– it is very short. I’m actually going to read most of this, and then we’re going to comment on it and how it ties into that Burger King campaign because it’s pretty cool. “Consumers are interested in more than check-ins and likes,” right? So they’re saying that there’s double digit growth expected into next year for this kind of geofenced or location-based services.

Matt: This is awesome.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: This and augmented reality which I can– we got to do another podcast now. We’re going to start podcasting in VR.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: Okay? They’re asking for Youtube content creators. I’m on that. Like we’re going to do that, we’re going to do that thing.

Chris: It’s going to be awesome. Alright so, “Recent studies show there’s increasing– that consumers are increasingly open to receiving special offers and other mobile alerts based on their geographic location.” Who wouldn’t be– like you’re walking by a cupcake store and wouldn’t want like– hey, you could get a dollar or two dollars off of it, depending on which cupcake store or off of the cupcake. Right? Like I don’t have– do you have a problem? I think some people do kind of inherently have a problem with their phone or the business knowing where you are. But then, when you’re in front of the cupcake store, and you get the $2 off, you’re like, “Oh, that’s kind of nice.” How about you?

Matt: I mean I wouldn’t–

Chris: You see? He’s looking very creeped out.

Matt: I wouldn’t have used the analogy of cupcakes because I was trying to decide like if a $2 cupcake thing popped up–

Chris: Yeah, yeah, yeah.

Matt: Would I do it? And I was like, “I’m not that into cupcakes.”

Chris: So what might work for you?

Matt: Now if it’s those cookies in the mall. You know? The little cookie cakes. You know what I’m talking about? The cookie cakes.

Chris: The big cookie company or whatever with the pizza cookies, yeah.

Matt: So it was just your offer. Your offer was not–‑

Chris: Yeah, wrong target! My targeting was off.

Matt: Yeah.

Chris: So, here are some of the things he’s talking about: 6 tips. “Off the fence.” So, “a geofence is a virtual perimeter around a physical space such as retail location or a bus stop.”

Matt: It’s an octagon.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: Just so you know.

Chris: Marketers are able to send text or push notification. You got to opt-in, right? So it’s based on your app. It’s gaining traction with retailers. A number of major brands are already experimenting with geofencing marketing in their products, as an example before you go Burger King.

Matt: Well, so push notifications on your website, okay? I would set this up, get them to opt in. Don’t use it all the time, don’t over use it. But man, if you can get them to opt-in on push notifications, there’s a lot of great things you can do reach your audience like popping up push notifications.

Chris: Yeah, on their browser.

Matt: Yeah.

Chris: Yeah, absolutely. Or if you’ve got an app, push notifications on their phone. Alright, first tip: “Follow the Customer. Build your geofences where your customers are, not where you want them to be.

Matt: Ah-ha.

Chris: Right, so you may say, “I want a geofence or beacon.” And the beacon obviously has got to be someplace very specific, like your place of business. But you got to think about where they’re going to be. “Consider locations other than your store.” Maybe airports, sporting events, some other places.

Matt: Well I know, I was just– I don’t know, I didn’t read the article.

Chris: Yeah. Just hold on a second. Let me keep going. So here’s an idea: you’ve got your customers, make a short list. Ask all of your customers where’s their favorite restaurant. Where do they get their hair done? If that’s relevant. where do they get their nails done? If that’s relevant. Ask this because you might find that your current customer base shops in some of the same places, or maybe it’s even the same area of town. Then you can geofence that place because their friends and the people who go there are also your prospects.

Matt: So target persona. So what I wanted to address, okay?

Chris: Okay.

Matt: The thing I like about geofencing specifically–

Chris: By the way, at this point we’re 1 out of 6, so he’s got a 5 out of 6 chance of ruining one of these tips, but go ahead.

Matt: Alright, I don’t know. I don’t know, this is exciting.

Chris: No, it’s good. Go for it. I liked it.

Matt: Alright, so here’s the deal. You can go back two years, datawise, right? So you think about how geofencing works, because a lot of people are like, “How does it really work?” Right? “And where is the ad inventory?” And all that sort of thing. But think about it on your phone. I use an iPhone, so I’m just going to use that example.

Chris: So just for clarity: there’s two types, right?

Matt: Yes, yes.

Chris: One of them is kind of app-in-the-moment driven, and then other one you’re talking about.

Matt: Yeah, yeah. So there’s two different ways you can do this with geofencing. It’s like realtime and those impressions– and you buy on impressions, and they’re a little more expensive because real time is usually better for leads.

Chris: Right.

Matt: Now if you want to capture your target persona and you want to look back, you can actually go back two years. And you can actually do this if you have Google My Maps. You can go back. Google has data back to 2012 where you have been. And that is creepy in itself, but they have that data–

Chris: Well because you go to creepy places.

Matt: Go check it out! See where I’ve been! Who knows? No, but even with iPhone, there’s that little privacy option. So it’s tracking where you’re going. So think about it. If there’s a major event, okay? And you’ve got a time period. You have days, something like. You can do it based on competitor, or location, or–

Chris: Let’s use some examples. Say you sell boots and in Houston there’s a rodeo.

Matt: Yes!

Chris: Right, so you could geofence that rodeo, not for just the last rodeo, right? It happens every year. But also the year before, all the way back at least two years, potentially more

Matt: Sure. I think that that’s another example, again– not hard to– I don’t like his examples but it is the right concept.

Chris: Christmas is coming soon, I’m quickly learning what not to get Matt for Christmas. No cowboy boots and no cupcakes, but we do have cookies. Cookies are on the list.

Matt: But what’s cool is you can buy data. So I’m doing this for one of our clients right. We’re going back, it’s for fitness and all these different runs and different things. Now you can geofence competitors and get aggressive there, but you can also look at past events. Going back two years and grab that data, so you can get it down to these second because again, that GPS is telling you exactly where you were on the Earth. And so you crossed that fence and any time in that period that that event was going on, or conference or whatever, you got that data and you can–

Chris: You’re now in the bundle.

Matt: And you can show those ads. And there’s actually a lot more things that you can do with that. But yeah, there’s’ really two types of geofencing: the real time and then also looking back. And those impressions are a little bit less expensive.

Chris: Alright. Hey, punch in the face to Jamie and Hyde, and Dean, and James, Samuel, actually tuning in for a little bit. Punch in the face to you guys for tuning with us on Facebook live. Also punch in the face to anyone who’s actually watching us on Youtube. That’s really cool.

Matt: And you’re going to get to see these nifty shirts.

Chris: SEO PPC.

Matt: Yeah, so boom.

Chris: eWebResults!

Matt: We got all kinds of shirts, check it out. We come out with new ones every week, really.

Chris: Feels daily. Number #2, “Bigger may not be better.” So “a geofence can be any size or shape, but larger geofences are not necessarily better. As a rule of thumb, the perimeter should be within five minutes of travel time to the target location.” And that’s if you’re doing really proactive real time, not what you were talking about data aggregation.

Matt: Yeah, yeah.

Chris: ANything longer than that reduces the relevancy of local messaging right? So one example is: we had a client who was interested on putting a billboard on a particular freeway here in Houston, because he knew that engineers from two particular companies went down that freeway because the office was there. And we’re like, “Don’t put a billboard, geofence those offices and then you can market to them directly.”

Matt: So what’s really funny here– and we’re talking about Silicon Valley, and also even these community colleges, right? Because the difference presidents kind of compete, and they’ll buy a billboard for their campus in front of the other campus. People are wasting so much money on billboards, and then even like executives out in Silicon Valley are doing this kind of thing of buying a billboard so other people drive in and see the billboard just to mess with each other. You can mess with each other through geofencing. I’m not encouraging it, but you can pick an IP address of a business to target, and then you could be like, “Hey business X this si Company Y. We would love to do business with you.” And you can target that location and everybody on that IP address. And you’re going to get a meeting from that, I can guarantee you.

Chris: Yeah, yeah.

Matt: So there’s a lot of things that—

Chris: In that meeting they may say, “Stop it.”

Matt: It’s true.

Chris: And I think all of it is messing with each other. Look at this Burger King ad. Like literally you have to be at a McDonald’s in order for this geofence to trigger so it can then redirect you to Burger King for a 1 cent hamburger.

Matt: That’s serious– that’s really quite messy.


Matt: Yeah!

Chris: In their face. Alright next, “Action is key: If your message is just an ad, you will not get the desired customer behavior.” Because they haven’t defined the behaviour. “Your message must be a brief, location-relevant, a call to action, and it must be important enough to engage the targeted user.” Right, so that’s what we’re talking about. Even in that ad, the cupcake ad – I know you’re not going to succumb to the cupcake ad – but the cupcake ad shouldn’t just say, “Hey, come get a cupcake for $2 off.” It should say, like in Houston, “You’re in Maryland Plaza, come to the cupcake shop.” Right, so it’s acknowledging where you are.

Matt: But you could also say, “We’ve made a special batch, just made–”

Chris: Just now.

Matt: “Of these cupcakes–”

Chris: You can smell them.

Matt: “And we only have a few left.

Chris: Come in and smell them for free.

Matt: But I mean you got to use the different– you got to use scarcity, you got to use reciprocity, you got to be speaking to them. There’s a number of different principles that you want to target, but it’s all about your offer, okay?

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: Your offer is what’s going to drive it. You can run the exact same campaign, same target audience, different offer, hugely different results.

Chris: Absolutely.

Matt: Yeah.

Chris: Absolutely. Next, “Timing is everything: Sending a retail store offer to nearby consumers during off-business hours does not make sense,” right? So if there’s a club next to the cupcake store, and you have your ads running so that people coming out of the clubs are enticed to go to the cupcake store – which is closed – you might end up with a broken window.

Matt: So this is something that even transcends to running Adwords Ads.

Chris: Yup.

Matt: You can really see in Google Analytics when the most conversions are coming from. How people are responding to your particular brand. Today I was talking with a client and we found out Wednesday and Thursday from 10 to 12 was when the most conversions happen. So I was like, “If you want to limit your budget–”

Chris: Load up the dollars then.

Matt: Load up the dollars then, and then tweak that. So, there’s a lot of ways that you can use data, geofencing is just another way to take this aggregated data and use it in a different format, you know?

Chris: Next, “Be transparent: Mobile marketing through GPS tracking can be annoying and unpleasant.” So as people, if you’re using this proactive one and people are downloading that Burger King app, Burger King is probably going to say, “We’re going to use your Geo data to send you special offers.” They may even have you opt in, right?

Matt: Well that’s what the push notifications too. You can really get overboard. And so you got to be careful with your marketing not to develop a bad brand.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: I can tell you, you can do a lot stuff with text messaging or SMS, like launching. So the people used to have these in their car, and they would drive by and it would just tag everybody around it, spam them. And so you got to be a little careful of that. But it’s a fun new technology, it’s not a silver bullet, but it’s really starting to capture that data more. Specially even with those beacons, okay? To be able to track someone walking in to the office.

Chris: Right.

Matt: And so these are two new technologies that are making a lot of progress. There’s a lot you can do with them. It’s really something to ad as kind of like the icing on a cake.

Chris: Right.

Matt: Not so much like this is a silver bullet.

Chris: This is like core strategy.

Matt: Yeah it’s not a core strategy, absolutely.

Chris: Yeah. Last is, “Be relevant.” I like this. “Make your message relevant by using other targeting parameters such as weather conditions, breaking news, and dynamically generate content.” For instance, it’s raining here in Houston. We’re supposed to get a lot of rain tonight. So if you’re walking by the cupcake store–

Matt: Snow cones– No snow cones.

Chris: Hey, it’s raining! Why don’t you come in and get some cupcakes.

Matt: And a hot coffee.

Chris: And a hot coffee, because Matt just said no to the cupcakes. I told you, you stupid app! I don’t want any cupcakes.

Matt: Well you know, you gotta move me to a different custom audience with a different targeting, with the different product.

Chris: Bowls of frosting available now. Matt has a sweet tooth every now and then. Alright, because the cookies are full of frosting if they’re done right. Alright, so that’s really it. If you like this podcast, we’re going to ask you to do something simple: Go ahead and share the podcast with three friends. You can do that now or you can do that later.

Matt: Anybody that works at a car dealership, anybody that’s working in a restaurant that wants to run Google Ads.

Chris: In the pool industry of any kind.

Matt: Yes. So there’s a lot of ways to use this technology for a lot of [00:21:47] [Indiscernible]

Chris: Oh you’re talking about the technology.

Matt: If you’re over there like a lead MMA and you’re trying to target another MMA location, trying to bring people over, I mean you’re going to start a fight and it’s going to be like street fighting. And so you got to be careful how you use it.

Chris: But that’s what they do.

Matt: I know, but not on the street.

Chris: Not in the street, oh that’s right. that’s right.

Matt: They like got a schedule. I’m going to meet you on the playground–

Chris: Yeah, with their diamonds or ref.

Matt: I’m going to meet you on the playground at this time.

Chris: After school.

Matt: After school, and we’re going to take it out.

Chris: And they want the teachers there just to be safe because it’s a great sport. My kids were in Jiu Jitsu for quite some time.

Matt: Did you know that – I didn’t know this okay? Fertitta, the Fertitta family.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: Okay, started it.

Chris: They started MMA?

Matt: I didn’t know that. No, I’m learning all kinds of things.

Chris: Ah.

Matt: So not his family, not the Houston family, but he’s got I guess other family up north.

Chris: Wow. So they started like the professional MMA like–

Matt: Yeah, from what I understand, I mean– so there’s a really good– when I talk to people all day long, I learn all kinds of interesting facts.

Chris: Cool stuff, yeah. And that was just one of them.

Matt: That was just one.

Chris: Wait you could do a whole podcast on interesting facts I learned on prospecting calls.

Matt: Yeah, I’m doing profit plans to the point that I’m losing my voice.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: I’m going to start doing webinars. Starting next year: webinars. Also, oh! Oh! I have three people right now that are asking me for information–

Chris: How to do a podcast.

Matt: How to do a podcast.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: I’m putting together a course. I’m going to have a course soon. I have one of my guys building a landing page right now. You can buy it at a discount before I make it. But we are going to be teaching you how to do–

Chris: The details.

Matt: How to do that. The second info product is some LinkedIn automation. I got a really good LinkedIn guy that we’re adding to the company next year.

Chris: Yeah.

Matt: And so we got a lot of fun things coming when we get our new location, our new training center. But if you’re looking to do a podcast, reach out to us. We’re putting together a course plus some consulting. We’ll help you get it up and going. No problem.

Chris: And if you just want something simple, like this really cool t-shirt here.

Matt: Yeah!

Chris: And there’s a whole collection of awesome internet marketing t-shirts available. You can just go to

Matt: /Swag

Chris: Swag! If you’re looking to grow your business with the largest, simplest marketing tool on the planet.

Matt: The internet!

Chris: Call eWebResults for increased revenue in your business: 713-592-6724. If you have a referral, we actually had somebody hit us up on Facebook through our Facebook bot: Chatbot.

Matt: Yes! Check out our Facebook bot! Yeah.

Chris: And he was like, “Can I submit a referral?” And of course we replied: “Yes!” Just go to our website, there’s a referral link. Submit the referral and you’ll be in line for the credit. That’s an ongoing recurring revenue stream.

Matt: Yeah, I know. We’ve got a couple people making quite a bit of money just by sending quality people over to us. We start working with them and you know, we want to build a relationship with you. We love you, thank you.

Chris: Yup.

Matt: So yeah.

Chris: So just to clarify: we do websites, we do landing pages, we do pay-per-click, we do Facebook ads – that’s pay-per-click but we ad words specific to–

Matt: A lot of people think we’re just an education company, and we’re building now the education company. And we’ve always been an agency, so it’s interesting.

Chris: Yeah. Alright, so please remember we were filmed live here at 5999 West 34th Street, Suite 106, Houston, Texas, 77092. Yeah, that’s written– Yeah, it is right.

Matt: You’re going to have to learn a new one.

Chris: Transcript! Transcript, video, and audio of this podcast is available at We are the Number #1 internet marketing podcast on iTunes. Over what’s the count? 3 million downloads of our podcast or something.

Matt: Last time I looked at it– I haven’t looked at it since then. I’ve been so busy I like literally just walked in here earlier.

Chris: Yeah, literally he’s like, “And thank you for calling.” Click: podcast. So thank you all, all of you all for being podcast listeners. We really appreciate you. Give us a ring if you need any help, any thoughts, if you want some input we do have a free website analysis. You can get that by going to our website and until the next podcast: my name is Chris Burres.

Matt: My name is Matt Bertram.

Chris: Bye bye for now.