Episode 527: 10 Enterprise Page Speed Optimizations & Implementation Tips by Matthew Bertram #527

Oh Hi Hi Figure that repeated I should repeat that Unknown secrets of internet marketing. My name is Chris Burris one of the owners of EW our digital My name is Matt Bertram. I'm the lead strategist here at EW our digital and we are having we had a slight technical glitch But it like it was nothing it was kind of fun. We we had fun with it Welcome back to another fun-filled edition of our podcast. This is podcast number 527 I missed out on 526 I Hear was good. I hear you're talking like technical stuff. Yeah, I we were just talking hosting stuff I didn't really have a roadmap and I need to talk into the mic into the mic. Can everybody hear me? All right. Yeah, so yeah. Yeah, we just had a conversation I was going from one meeting to the next and we just kind of jumped in it and started talking about hosting and issues related to that Maybe we should add a little bit more of agenda, but hopefully people got some value Because we had William on and he was going into some technical things. Yes, he was William is one smart cat. That is for sure Remember Matt and I are broadcasting live from Houston, Texas And and as part of your results driven agency EW our digital And you can tell that we're live because we don't edit anything out and for all kinds of bloopers, yeah Literally from day one of this podcast I was like we have a zero edit policy because I know that editing can be a black hole of time I was actually talking about it earlier today. We're like three hours later. Yes, that 10 seconds is done Let's move on to the next 10 seconds of editing Yeah, we wanted to try and avoid that plus I think you get a more authentic version Of us knowing, you know, because we're actually live knowing that we're not going to do it We make we make mistakes and that we're human. I

mean, yes. Yeah, we're broadcasting that. Yeah. Yeah, it's it's pushed out there Hey, we've got a review. This is from Dominique Olson It is of course It said started listening to the most recent podcast I didn't understand anything you guys were talking because SEO digital marketing was completely new to me Decided to go back to podcast number one brave soul. I mean, this is 527 so I could get a better understanding listen to about 75 got a bunch of good information and understanding now I jumped to 450 that was still quite a while ago to get more relevant information My website went from it went from it says from one page to 20. Oh from Probably ranking in the SERPs from pay. Yeah, so it improved but But he didn't kind of it isn't well defined you there wouldn't consider myself a pro But I'm constantly working on content SEO and new info you guys give me Website is taking off and only started this about three weeks ago Once I get caught up, I'll go back and review the key areas that interest me Thanks for all the great information and all that you do Patif to you Dominique that was like yes, this is that's why we do this Yeah Yes, it is no I mean, I I think that you know somebody that wants to be a sponge and soak up a lot of information and You know a lot of the fundamentals are certainly out there and concepts and strategies and yeah by Binge listening to our podcasts. You're gonna pick up a lot of great information. So and We get to share that we are sponsored. We are sponsored by a H refs and let me talk about their free tool so a H refs webmaster tool is powerful and free age refs created a WT for website owners who can't yet afford a marketing budget for a professional SAO tool But need organic traffic to their website almost 300,000 people signed up for the a WT tool last year

All of them use almost half of a H refs product functionality for free Matt. You like free Yeah, I feel like free is good Seriously at zero dollars not even a credit card is required to sign up that like causes people to hold back Sometimes there is nothing to hold you back Tech radar said that a WT makes SEO more accessible to others We use a lot of tools and we use a lot of expensive tools and we're very happy to have H reps as a sponsor We're very happy to be talking about Their free set of tools and what a positive impact that can have on the SEO I mean the the reality is is that maybe Dominique is already on the a WT free version and taking advantage of the SEO insights. He can get there Now that that would be awesome. I I think you're so good at that Chris. I really I thought you did a great job Good Good solid I like a trust we use it Daily, I would say probably so. All right, so we have an article today that we pulled entirely randomly from Search Engine Journal and the author Wait, it's it's Matt Bertram I feel like that probably wasn't random It is is this your first article in Search Engine Journal or just one of the articles that you've had in Search Engine Journal it it's one of the articles, but Yeah, excellent. So this is 10 enterprise page speed optimizations and implementation tips Like that that says it all it's really important. This is an article is published October 5th, we're bringing it to you November 11th like timely Frankly page speed and optimization is is always timely like we're always working on that for new clients as they come in State page speed is a ranking factor If you aren't optimizing pages to load quickly, you not only miss the opportunity to provide a great experience But you may not appear high enough in the rankings to even get found at all. I

think that's a that's a profound statement Yeah, you should be focusing on page speed. In fact, you go on to say It's kind of weird you go on to say Maybe I shouldn't be saying this You're already monitoring page speed great You're on the right track if you're not then make it a priority to do so page speed is is so very important There are plenty of ways to address the slow page speeds We're gonna talk about ten of them and then also I thought I'd turn that off then we're gonna talk about how you kind of navigate an enterprise company right that like the the dynamics of an enterprise company to get some of these things done because You know Matt has a lot of experience Navigating enterprise level companies and and actually getting these things done. Well, no, it's it's funny I I tend to write these articles or I started writing these articles because And and even in my book right like I write kind of like based on the experiences. What's the title of that book? Build your brand mania I Feel like both of us should have a copy now We're I feel like we're amateurs because we don't have the copy of build your brand mania in our hands Yeah, no, but these are these are legitimate Issues that companies are dealing with and so I'm just expounding upon those issues and Highlighting those issues and if one company so my next article that's about to come out is Actually about like on-page optimization because I had a client say why do we have to keep Reoptimizing the same page like how many times can you optimize that same page? And you know, the thing is about Google based on the search based on the keyword. I'm getting a little feedback, but It's okay on this end, okay good, but but essentially Every time someone does a search based on a different keyword the algorithm runs a different way and Show up in the search results differently and so

how you move stuff around the page actually makes a big difference it's kind of like a kaleidoscope, I guess a little bit that you got to keep changing it and That was a really good question. It was something that I wanted to Go into further details. That's actually my So So I like the phrase you calls them as you see them or you writes them as you experience them Is that I I said that no, I Called them as I see them is like as an old kind of famous thing You're like I'm pretty sure my editor caught that I don't I don't think that That slipped through the cracks. No like you're in the you're in the throes of in this case Navigating an enterprise business and getting page speed optimized and you're like well let's write an article about that because it's you know, it took up a Couple of months of my life to make this happen So there's probably other people out there who need to be you know, you know So there's probably other people out there who need to be aware of it and and how to deal with it. So it's awesome Alright, they're ten. Number one is leverage browser caching When a user visits your site the client and server begin a resource exchange Data from your website typically static assets like logos styles backgrounds and images Download to the users hard drive and are stored there for a predetermined period of time Initially this process eats up bandwidth However, when the data is cached that information is already available So let's say you go to page two you don't need and if you've properly cached the website You pull down the logo on on the home page So when you're on that second page, you don't need to download that logo anymore this leads to faster load times and much better experiences for users and You do have to take the time to define these factors how long should the logo stay resident? You may want

to cache content that rarely changes for up to a year or you can use e tags to make conditional cache Requests when content changes Matt roof e tag. Well, what was an e tag again? Well, like yeah, like if you're on mobile or something like that, it's just kind of the tracking tax So it tracks how long or Making sure that the the contents actually up-to-date, right? It's the latest and greatest version So so that's number one leverage browser caching number two is clean up code That's that's that's that seems so easy, right? Just hey Have the team clean up the code No, I mean on so so on WordPress like if you're using a visual builder or something there's there's a lot of sometimes heavy code in there and I mean going back to the beginning days of the internet like people hard-coded websites in HTML right and so Very clean code most of the time and so these WordPress websites are pretty heavy You know, there's like PHP There's a lot of stuff that it doesn't necessarily need and that's something that you should even look at like certainly even with plugins Which will just later Have different weights, you know, and so You know These are just things to consider how heavy is your your website? Like what are all the elements that have to load that sort of thing? So So you say search engines, especially Google rely on many factors determine a site's ranking One of the most important is crawl ability or how easily it can access and crawl the content on your site Because enterprise I like I like what you brought to the forefront here because you don't become an enterprise organization Overnight like it takes a while to be enterprise level because enterprises often have a long digital history their Foundational website coding can be outdated inefficient or littered with unintended errors that accumulate over time Through though time-consuming a thorough audit of your code helps you identify issues and address them as Necessary and yes,

they're there. They're necessary to address because Google you want Google to be able to crawl your website easily Legacy issues are real All right, number three is enable server-side Compression so your web server may be fast and your own internet connection may be fast But you want to plan for people accessing your website on a slower 4g or even 3g cell phone connection And maybe your target market is like even slower than that enable server-side compression with algorithms like Sprotly or gzip makes it easy to compress those assets so that they are less of a burden for both your server and The user I put just the comment do it like do server-side compression Figure out what you need to make that happen because there's because it speeds up your site or reach out to co-host Where that's part of what we do with SEO focused hosting All right number four get a content delivery network So content delivery networks also referred to as content distribution networks are often also Referred to as content distribution networks when you use a CDN a group of geographically distributed Servers will work together to quickly deliver site content reducing load times and bandwidth Consumption as an added bonus in some cases the CDN's can also add a layer of security to data Transfers well that won't help with page speed it can benefit brand reputation and integrity efforts I don't know if you wanted to kind of expound on that Yeah, I mean, I think that like something like cloudflare are incredibly valuable from even a security standpoint because Someone can't attack your website directly. It's kind of like a mirror That it's shining off it. And so when you're doing kind of drive-by hacking You know it protects you But yeah, I mean something like cloudflare we recommend for our clients or you know big players Amazon Azure all have Comparable products but for most people WordPress Cloudflare Excellent choice to look into it. So yeah, and I can tell you cloudflare is easy to use All

right, number five avoid landing page redirects So redirects are commonplace, but that doesn't mean they're ideal They can be particularly troublesome for SEO I've heard kind of estimates that each time you're doing a redirect you may lose 15% of your link juice so like Try not to do them and then you gave these tips before you use a redirect Here are some things to consider Use the correct redirect though 302 301 and 307 redirects will all move from one URL to the preferred one They aren't created usually equally You if you use the wrong one, the crawlers might not Crawl them correctly Avoid redirect chains. That's where you're like Redector redirecting from one to the next to the next to the next again If you're losing 15% of link juice It doesn't take very long where that link from a reputable source Maybe a high da website is no longer a value because you've redirected it so many times don't do that And use responsive layouts which can cut down on unnecessary mobile landing page redirects I think that's related to Kind of an older scheme which you still see every now and then where there was actually a mobile Version of the website as opposed to a responsive version of the website the M dot right? And every time we would build a landing pages, we would have to build two of them, right? and only there's a lot of tools out there like unbalanced that still offer those services the You know, I think they're nice in some some formats Certainly if you're going to be doing that on WordPress, you need to understand that it can mess up your headers, right? and so sometimes Google will Look at the headers that maybe you're showing for mobile and then for desktop and then it'll look like you have Two sets of headers that are duplicate. So you need to be looking out for that But but yeah, I think that Three or ones three or twos are really really important we actually had

a website that when you refer to one of your friends that had a bunch of Daisy chain redirects and it slowed down the website Like when we looked at it because it didn't go directly to the right source I think there was a series of three redirects and when we fix that we took the website from I think eight or nine seconds to under three Just by fixing the redirects. So yeah. Yeah, this is a An article about 10 enterprise page speed optimization and implementation tips One of them is don't don't daisy-chain your redirects Alright next number six use lazy loading So traditionally web page content, especially images. They're loaded simultaneously This may seem efficient But when it comes to page speed the opposite is true Site users have to wait a long longer time for all of the content to load Lazy loading prioritizes content based on what the user will see and or interact with first The common question here is does that affect page load metrics meaning? Yeah, you've been lazy You've loaded the things that the that the user is going to interact with is going to see first But you're still loading if you do it, right? The answer is that it doesn't negatively impact your Your the numbers that you're getting so even though the page isn't completely loaded You'll receive full credit for the load page. Once the above the fold content is visible to the user That's also called the largest content pull paint Yes for sure that that's what every but you know, there's arguments on like, you know to to that Is that good work or not? I would just say When you're setting it up You know if it doesn't negatively affect the user experience right like of like where you're going to click and where stuff's going to load and You know how like sometimes you're going to a website you're having you're you're trying to click on a button and everything's moving, right? And so You you build out. Hey, this is

Where that image is going to be and it's maybe a little fuzzy or something like that it it I think it improves the overall user experience because while it's loading The visitor knows that something's happening, right? like the worst thing is like when you click on the link and then like nothing's happening because it's all loading at the same time and You're you don't even know if the website's working and you're seeing the little maybe it's broken Yeah, you're like, I don't I don't know what's going on. But but this way things keep happening things keep loading. It's in the right place And they know that there's going to be something there and I'm a big fan of it If you if you set it up properly because you know, not everything needs to load in That order and you want to kind of look from the server side Okay, how you know what needs to load win, right? So yep. Absolutely Alright number seven improve server response time So there are two crucial aspects to addressing server response time and maybe there's one kind of overriding one Which is have a really awesome server. That's Responsible for serving the content, right? So it's doing a good job But one of the aspects you also need to address is to use static page caching so static page caching is where When you think in terms of like a CRM, right? No, CMO content management system CMS CRM when you think in terms of a content management system You're you're looking at something like WordPress is constantly doing calculations to display the page for you, right? So it's saying hey, let me grab the footer. Let me grab the header Maybe let me grab this image from the from the media file Let me do all of this stuff to actually send to the server. That's all on the server side So you want to use server side caching where it puts together that page if that page doesn't change very often Then you want to

store that version of that page and then you're just feeding that page You don't have to recalculate that page every time. So that's one aspect Well, so so a little bit more on um server like make sure you have a server close to where your customers are Right, so it doesn't have to go Uh around the world and then you know, um shared hosting versus like a semi-dedicated or dedicated hosting Depending on I mean, that's a whole separate ball of wax But there's a lot of stuff that you need to think about um on on the server side of things and really where your website's being hosted should be um One of the first things that you figure out and where you should put the most attention from the security to the maintenance Um to the speed that that is something that I think people bypass a lot so people spend thousands of dollars on seo when um, Maybe they they need to focus on uh, some server maintenance right and speeding up, uh their website and that's where you get your biggest bang for your buck and that's what I Always recommend people do first. So well, it's really the reason why we put together co-host right? Like that's that is the reason um The second app aspect for a lot of websites and really that's websites using php That includes wordpress joomla a lot of websites are using php is to ensure that the web hosting provider servers Allow for a persistent opcode cache, right? So this is uh gets into more details But it's related to how php applications run How they show human readable code and you want to be able to cache that piece of the code So that's persistent opcode cache Sometimes we get technical on here if you've ever seen a site that's extremely fast right up until you get to the checkout part It's usually due to this missing component. So take care of that component also yeah, no, uh Search engine journal wants you to get

more technical than like forbes or somewhere else. So, um gotta Gotta give them a little bit more meat, you know, you gotta be fancy gotta be fancy. Is that it? Yeah number eight Optimize site media and this is kind of obvious and you know We could argue that should be number one if people were going through this list, right? Because it is where you can get some really big, you know bang for your buck And this goes to if you're using images or video make sure that they aren't larger than necessary Make sure they're appropriately formatted make sure that they compress visual assets to decrease load time I can't tell you how many times we had a customer we built a website for them It's in wordpress so that they can manage it themselves and then they would come back three months and like my website is crawling And you like go there and this is gonna you know a little slower internet days But you know the the opening image would just load like one pixel row at a time It's like you have a 10 meg Image for like that's crazy. You don't use a big image like that. It's not necessary So make sure you optimize that I mean it sounds like a no-brainer And you you'd be surprised even today how many people are not doing that, right? So there's a process when you upload websites, so You know anytime we build a website if if they're taking and have internal people that are taking over Their marketing or or to do it. Um, we really do some corporate training and we lay out um, you know the steps that you would go through to compress an image because you know, if you run lighthouse Um, you can typically see man images are not compressed how many times I mean the mobile phone images are massive, right? I don't even know how big they are But but people will just take an image and upload it and they don't oh you

mean the pictures people take with mobile phones Those images are massive. Yeah, those are massive images. Okay, I guess from a picture quality standpoint, they They they have to be but people will just take those images and upload into a website or they'll take you know Like no one no one's thinking about size or compression Um, like if you're building a portfolio if you're adding, um, you know people on your about us page I mean, there's so many reasons why uh people might be uploading stuff or with the blogs whatever it is But they're not compressing the images and it sounds like an over-brainer It sounds like a duh, but but man, like I can tell you it happens more times than not. Yeah. Yeah All right number nine improve html and css structure Html and css that have not been optimized will increase increase page weight or the size of your page Um, does that mean that you need to have someone go page by page manually reviewing code? No, uh, there are some great tools out there css minify Uh dirty markup that can automate the process of revising the code Uh and optimizing it so make sure you take advantage of those tools Yeah, and that just goes back to the builders that I was talking about in the beginning. Um, you know how they're built sometimes You know, you might not need um, whatever A lamborghini to drive around like houston in bumper traffic, right? Of course you do. Well, I mean you know, so but You know sometimes you you get built out on the programming side a lot more than you need And so depending on your website, it might not be using some of that functionality And so it's better to like go in and like turn it off or or not have it load Uh, because it helps speed it up like you want your website as light as possible. So Absolutely. All right, and number 10 again 10 enterprise page speed optimization and implementation tips This

and we bump into this so often with new clients themes and plugins When it comes to creating an integrated experience for both front end and back end users themes and plugins can be a real value Some can but you got to be aware some can create significant page lag Don't get rid of all those third-party assets instead only use plugins and themes from a reputable source Make sure you're using the latest version and make sure that you keep the amount of them that you use to a minimum When you add new plugins or themes to a page always closely monitor page speed To quickly identify if there are any issues causes by that new plugin or that new theme or increased bounce rates or unsatisfied users Um, man, we bumped into theme we bump into theme and plugin issues just all the time Well people just add plugins right they they go to the marketplace and they're like, oh this is cool This is cool, and they add all this to it And then they don't they they don't take that that code off or they don't keep it updated. So it becomes like security risks Um, you know and a lot of this stuff on here um like cleaning up code or something like that sometimes you do need to hire like a software engineer or someone to go in and Um kind of look at some of that stuff and clean it up Not everything that you can do is on your own sometimes there's heavy lifting but certainly, um Trying to keep plugins to a minimum making sure that they're updated making sure that they don't break anything is incredibly important um, I can tell you that's something we see a lot too if people come to us and like Why do you have all these plugins right? And and it's again that legacy component that um, you know, they maybe used it in the past and they no longer use it and it's just Still there. I mean look at a

lot of people's uh desktops, you know Of things that they've downloaded or what have you I mean, you want to keep it as clean as possible uh for google, uh and for low time Etc. So you don't want it to look like my browser because my browser usually has like an 100 open tabs You don't want that you don't want that mess and this again is and you've touched on this is tied into enterprise Where it's the legacy of things like so maybe you had to add a plugin in order to get your 301 redirects And so you got a 301 redirect plugin But now you've got an seo tool that handles the 301 redirects and you should have uninstalled the 301 redirect tool But you you didn't get around to it I mean that you you want to use plugins you if you don't have bearing again, don't use a plugin like I mean There's schema I mean there's there's so much stuff out there, but what I can tell you is um on the enterprise side Uh, it's just incredible. Um, uh, how these websites are um Still going sometimes right? um, and and uh, you know as people transition, uh from brick and mortar to e-commerce um The website becomes a lot more interactive Especially with web 2 to web 3 Uh, I mean, so I think that there's going to be a huge kind of upgrade here. But I mean look I had a Enterprise client come to me. They had 16 brands that they were managed on different cms's um, they were using different marketing agencies some Uh were hosted in different places. I mean it was like like we had to build a 18 month plan to figure out um, you know how one or two people internally can manage all these things, uh, and You know, it it was just a lot of like over time We did this and then you know based on this use case We did this and and you know, if you've had

a website for for any length of time You're going to start seeing that right and and really you need to be upgrading your websites Uh every couple years or when new technology Uh comes comes to the forefront I think one of the biggest analogies people like well, why can't you just update it and it's sometimes you know depending on the issue, but it's kind of like, you know, there was um, uh Cameras, right that were 1080p or whatever And then 4k came out like hey turn this camera. That's 1080p or whatever into 4k like how do you do that like sometimes You can't like you just have to go buy a new one, you know, you need to go buy the 4k one Yeah All right. So this last section really I want matt to talk and i'll give him a couple talking points But I want to you want him to talk about managing internal hurdles in an seo in an enterprise seo situation Um, so let's let's talk about this. I mean you wrote about this, but let's talk about You got to have a clear and compelling value statement you got to be systematic and purposeful with your requests You got to maybe consider adding a developer to your marketing team So right so that might be a message directly to an enterprise level. Hey, if you got a marketing team Maybe you need a developer there that you that the company trusts to have access to a kind of server level stuff And then identify a liaison or dedicated it department member to work with the marketing department so talk about that a little bit like working in the environment of an enterprise, uh company enterprise level company With you know seo strategies and really kind of page speed optimization strategies well, I I think seo is uh something that um, You you have to start building into the culture. Okay, and and and typically at an enterprise level, uh, Company you have different domains. Oh it might be over this

marketing might be over this and you got to figure out Where that line is? um, and you got to understand, uh how to get uh approvals through Or to get uh access to different resources or programmers to get certain things accomplished you have to work um, you know cross-functioning with teams you've got to get Approvals and and so it really goes back to like a culture of seo and and really if you have like one or two people Internally at an organization. It's very very difficult to to be able to do. Um, Uh, you know seo for the the whole company and a lot of times that that seems to be the case really what you have to do is uh teach people about how to Kind of incorporate that into what they're doing and how important it is in the bigger picture I mean really seo is digital pr which is just general branding. I think that seo over time is going to probably fade as like a seo specialist and it's just going to be like marketers that understand Like seo is I think where it's probably going to go and there's not going to be Like these special like a ppc specialist and you know a social media specialist It's going to be really you're a digital marketer that you utilize these different tools together to build whatever uh that strategy is and so Um, that's the biggest tip I would give people out there dealing uh with maybe some red tape or at an enterprise, uh level company is You have to try to get people to understand um it from a cultural standpoint of this is what we do and this is important and Um that's done through education. So yeah No, that makes sense and it there can be hurdles Um, not just technical with an enterprise website, right one that's kind of evolved and have has legacy issues There are legacy issues and how communication can work inside and now you're throwing in a new thing you look

at Traditional marketing and how uh often traditional marketing is like let's get really creative. Let's throw a lot of money at this and then Yeah, it'll probably work right where and then you bring a digital marketer into it and they're like hey So I spent ten dollars and I made 50 Do you want me to do that again? Or do you like or do you want me to try some other strategy where it's where the data is so Available and important. Yeah, I mean that's the biggest bridge from traditional to digital is the data analytics and being able to know what what is happening and um how to make decisions, uh based upon uh, what's happening in the data a lot of times you run a A tv ad or a billboard or a radio and you're like, yeah, I think this is going to go great Right and and then you run it and you're done right, but um, you can get data in real time and you can make adjustments uh, and you can optimize And uh, the data is power, right? um and and that's just I think what um, what I fell in love with with digital marketing is um, you can do something and then you can immediately see what's happening how people are interacting with it and then um go through those iterations to to improve it and that's typically how you can take the You know your analogy of the 10 bucks and make 50 right? Um, that might not happen right out of the gate, right? That that's Um continuously optimizing it but again, uh, whether it's through ad dollars or sto Um the return on investment with digital Uh is is phenomenal and just in today's culture and how you know online is your first first foot forward um a lot of businesses I think with covid, uh, everything got expedited they kind of woke up to um digital first mobile first, right so Even in that 10 to 50 example, I mean, hey, I spent

ten dollars and I made a dollar Uh, here are the changes I think we need to make in order to to do it better Like you just don't have that with a billboard, you know, you typically don't have that with uh with the you know, traditional marketing And so it they are different types of conversations and it's about that Um kind of updating the legacy conversation Yeah, no, absolutely so all right, so um That is that wraps up our podcast. Uh, we would like you to leave us a review. I I want to give Uh a big patiff to the author. Wait, let me look that up again Oh, that's right. It's me matt. It's you. Thank you. Good article. Well done, sir Um, I also want to give a big uh patiff to dominique olson Uh, thank you for taking the time to write that review Thank you for going back and listening to 75 plus podcasts and then starting at 450 To get all the way to 527 We really appreciate you. Hopefully anybody else out there who's getting some value you can leave us a review Also go to ewrdigital.com Uh forward slash review that will get you directly to our our gmb so you can leave us a review, please make that Or You you know also if if you're dealing with an issue, right, um You can reach out to our agency ewrdigital.com. Uh, you can set up a free discovery call with one of our digital marketers Um, we would love to talk to you So you will get value out of that call like we have a lot of testimonials just from the value from that initial Uh free consult consultation, so we we love to leave people with lots of value like why we're doing this podcast Uh, so leave that review and then I don't know that's that's good enough. Just leave a review there Oh, you can just go to our facebook.com forward slash best seo podcast and leave a review there Uh until the

next podcast, my name is chris burrus. My name is matt pertram Bye. Bye for now You