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#468 – The Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing

Join Matt and Chris for another thrilling episode of the Best SEO Podcast!

TRANSCRIPT:

Chris Burress:

Hi and welcome to the SEO Podcast, Unknown Secrets of Internet Marketing. My name is Chris Burress, one of the owners here at eWebResults.

Matt Bertram:

My name is Matt Bertram, one of the CEOs here…

Chris Burress:

One of the?

Matt Bertram:

The CEO at eWebResults.

Chris Burress:

Welcome back to another fun filled edition of our podcast. We are so glad you are joining us.

Matt Bertram:

I think we should start over since we’re not live.

Chris Burress:

Please remember there’s no editing and we don’t even start over. Please remember we are filmed live in Houston, Texas and Matt and I, we are your results rebels.

Matt Bertram:

Cowabunga.

Chris Burress:

Cowabunga.

Matt Bertram:

That’s what cowabunga is.

Chris Burress:

I got a review. I want to jump into this review, it’s of course five stars.

Matt Bertram:

Five stars.

Chris Burress:

It’s from Michael SEO, that’s his name is Michael SEO.

Matt Bertram:

I like that.

Chris Burress:

His parents were pretty smart and understood what he was going to do in his life and so changed their name.

Matt Bertram:

Maybe he changed his name?

Chris Burress:

This is the best SEO podcast on the internet. We consistently review SEO podcasts and Chris and Matt’s podcast is by far our favorite. Wowee, so it’s like a team. We appreciate the user generated questions and honest opinions. Your business will improve by being a regular listener. [Pertif 00:01:21] to you Michael, we’re so excited about your review. We really appreciate it.

Matt Bertram:

No, that’s good. I actually have heard that. We got a couple of people out there pitching on podcasts and she’s listening to all the different podcasts.

Chris Burress:

That’s a new service that we’re offering. So if you want to get onto a podcast and grow your business, whatever kind of business it is, could be a coaching business, could be a profit-based business-

Matt Bertram:

Well this is going to be an add-on service, it’s not going to be a frontline service, so it’s going to be for existing customers.

Chris Burress:

You could make a phone call and it might happen.

Matt Bertram:

You just talk to Chris.

Chris Burress:

He’ll do it. Yeah. So she’s listening to-

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, she’s listening to all these podcast. Maybe she’s just saying it, but she said that we’re the best. She said we have the most value.

Chris Burress:

Okay. I think that’s true.

Matt Bertram:

I think a lot of people just banter, like we’re about to do on this one since you have no article.

Chris Burress:

Yeah, since I have no article. There’s the teaser, we have no article. We’re going to talk about social media’s impact, one on businesses in general, and two potentially the impact on search engine optimization. I’m going to be relying on the guy who’s wearing the Facebook shirt, senator, we run ads too.

Matt Bertram:

Too, I should’ve probably underlined that.

Chris Burress:

It’s interesting, because it looks like; senator, we run ads to eWebResults.

Matt Bertram:

Well no, then there’s a dash.

Chris Burress:

I know, but if you read it “Senator, we run ads to eWebResults” that’s one of the things that we do. If this is the first time you’ve listened to the podcast; howdy and welcome to the podcast. We’re in Texas, so we do say that and-

Matt Bertram:

I went to A&M so I do say that as well.

Chris Burress:

Yeah. Apparently it’s a big deal at A&M, I hear that every week. If you could leave us a review, we’ve got that review. I didn’t find any others, it’s been a little while. Go ahead and leave a review at Google My Business, you can do that by going to ewebresults.com/gplus. That’ll get you directly to our page.

Matt Bertram:

There you go. Not a lot of people are talking about G Plus too much anymore.

Chris Burress:

Yeah. Well, G Plus is Google My Business. It’s just shorter, G Plus.

Matt Bertram:

What about GMB?

Chris Burress:

It’s a leftover.

Matt Bertram:

Do people say GMB? Besides people in the industry?

Chris Burress:

Probably-

Matt Bertram:

Most people listen to us that are in the industry.

Chris Burress:

Industry, that’s true.

Matt Bertram:

They know what GMB.

Chris Burress:

They know what GMB. We can add that, I can add that.

Matt Bertram:

I want you to read the whole code to get there.

Chris Burress:

Okay. W, lowercase Y, upper case Z, one, five, dollar sign, exclamation mark, period. That’s why we make it easy.

Matt Bertram:

I like it, no qualms here.

Chris Burress:

What we would like you to do, if you’ve listened to this before you’re probably interested in some tips from us.

Matt Bertram:

No, no, no. I don’t like your tips. No more tips, no.

Chris Burress:

Don’t worry about the tips.

Matt Bertram:

The tips are here, we’re-

Chris Burress:

In the podcast. Listen to it, Best SEO Podcast.

Matt Bertram:

I don’t need people downloading it.

Chris Burress:

That’s fine. What we would like you to do is to shikow us.

Matt Bertram:

Yes. Share, like, follow.

Chris Burress:

And when you shikow you hear, shi-kow! That’s what you hear. We also do offer some free services that you guys could take advantage of.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah we do a free, we moved it from a 15 minute to 30 minute because we overdid it. We always over do it.

Chris Burress:

It was always 30 minutes anyway. We’re still over doing it.

Matt Bertram:

So 30 minute free consulting session with one of our specialists. I think that that’s just really, really valuable for a lot of people. You have a big question that you’re trying to get solved, we’re more than willing to try to help you do it if we can do it pretty quick and get really get you on the right track. If you have to go more in depth you might have to go into one of the paid consulting sessions, but I really see a lot of people getting a ton of value from-

Chris Burress:

We get reviews just based on the 30 minutes.

Matt Bertram:

Well yeah, so we moved profit plans like the two hour consulting to half day or a quarter of a day or three quarters of a day marketing session. So people are actually wanting more and more of it and then wanting some more defined paper.

Chris Burress:

Right, like on paper strategies.

Matt Bertram:

We really expanded our offering and we’re really focused on providing more higher level strategy for medium size, large businesses, and a marketing workshop is a great way to do that.

Chris Burress:

We get great reviews off of a 30 minute consultation. We get great reviews off of that. Some of the advice is like, “Hey, maybe you’re starting a new business and you don’t even know, hey, is this the right thing? What’s going to be the right marketing strategy for this business? It’s kind of at the infancy.” We can help you with that. Maybe you’re growing, you’ve got a $10 million business and you want to take it to the $100 million level, reach out to us.

Matt Bertram:

Chris can provide great e-commerce strategies. We were just meeting with another business center over lunch-

Chris Burress:

I kind of blew you away, didn’t I?

Matt Bertram:

Yeah. He pulled some stuff out his pocket, he’s like, “This is something I haven’t even told Matt yet.” He’s laying it out there on the table, and really this guy has multiple businesses in different areas that he was running, some e-commerce strategies, and we really laid out a really solid foundation for how we might want to approach things, and you were adding some great value. I was learning from the conversation too.

Chris Burress:

Cool stuff. Well that’s what we do when we meet. You can’t push that button on yourself. We have some sound buttons. So really we’re going to jump right in to this. We’re going to talk about social media. We’ve changed the social media offerings that we have here at eWebResults. And when I say we, I mean Matt has changed them, and of course we’ve brainstormed and it makes sense and we’re driving this. We want to talk to you about how we’re using social media and how it ties into… Because really the reality behind search engine optimization; it’s a complex beast. We talk about 250 ranking factors at Google, but you want to talk about success of a business, a business that you maybe you get placed well and they land on your website, but they want to do more research, where else are they going to go? Because your website is going to be biased for you if you’re smart.

Matt Bertram:

So one of the things that we’re really moving into Chris, that I think it’s the right direction, but I think there’s going to be further education that’s involved as we work with clients is really doing a lot of research on the front end. And typically for small business owners come in, we’re delivering content, we’re really good at execution right out the door. We’ve slowed that down providing strategy the first month and then you’re right, yeah.

Chris Burress:

Strategy upfront.

Matt Bertram:

And then going into month two we start working on deliverables. Well now depending on who we’re bringing on and how with the SEO audits we’re doing on the front end in that first month, we’re leaving the door open to insert a whole month of technical SEO. And not just like bandaids, but fundamentally restructuring what they’re going to do, because if we do it right on the front end we can get them to rank so much quicker. It’s really making the website more aerodynamic dynamic to fly up Google’s rankings. And in some of the websites we’re building from the ground up and really the amount of work that’s going into it, we’re going to need to start charging more. But the websites we’re building now are ranking in the first month.

Chris Burress:

In the first month.

Matt Bertram:

In the first month based on taxonomy, based on how we’re setting up the inner linking of the pages, really making sure there’s no content gaps. So really that planning phase there, the better we do that the more it’s going to be on the backend in the long run. And so instead of trying to make a bag of bricks fly, we’re fundamentally-

Chris Burress:

By the way, bags of bricks are not very aerodynamic as it comes to flying up the Google ranking. By the way, I think that’s the first time you’ve said flying up the Google ranking and I like that.

Matt Bertram:

Well that’s really what everybody wants, right?

Chris Burress:

Yes.

Matt Bertram:

Everybody wants to just rank on the first page and like, “Hey, I’m giving you money for SEO, get me on the first page, get me to the top of the rankings now.”

Chris Burress:

Yes, yesterday.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, and it’s becoming a lot more difficult to do that. There’s a lot more people coming into the space, people are throwing money at things and the way to beat them is to go after long tail key phrases, but also to build a faster car. Like instead of racing, and I don’t know, whatever analogies.

Chris Burress:

Instead of running down the track, pushing the car down the track, spend the time on the car.

Matt Bertram:

Instead of pushing something heavy down the track, make something really, really light and you can run fast. I don’t know what analogies are the right analogy to use, but what we’re seeing is SEO, the term SEO, even like LinkedIn SEO, we’re going to talk about social media, Facebook SEO, there’s YouTube SEO. SEO, that term has become so broad and then even a conversion optimization. So if I get you the traffic, okay, that doesn’t mean you’re getting leads.

Chris Burress:

Because you mentioned earlier that clients are interested in flying up that Google page.

Matt Bertram:

That’s one piece of it.

Chris Burress:

What they’re really interested in is the results that happened from being in that position. The phone calls, the form submissions.

Matt Bertram:

The leads that are coming in. With one of our partners that we sat down with today, fundamentally how to define that, how to break that down and how to figure out exactly how much traffic you’re going to need to produce those kind of results. And that’s really the direction that you have to go in, because it’s a math problem, it’s a formula.

Chris Burress:

It certainly is for the business owners, right?

Matt Bertram:

Yes.

Chris Burress:

It’s literally, I’m going to outlay this cash, whether that includes paid whatever the strategy looks like, if it’s all SEO, whatever. SEO is a little bit more of a challenge because there’s this lag time, but at some point I’ve got to be making enough money to cover that expense and also then make up for what I’ve invested so far.

Matt Bertram:

Well, so I’m getting a lot of questions these days. Is they understand the value of SEO, they see, “Hey, I’m ranking for these terms, I’m seeing leads coming in.” I’ve had two clients come to me, two clients, and this is in the last week that have come to me and said, “Tell me the number that it’s going to take to put me in first position in Google. Give me the number.”

Chris Burress:

What is the number? They know the value. They’ve been in business long enough, they’ve maybe even been there a couple of times. They know the value of being in that first position. They just want to know how much is it going to cost.

Matt Bertram:

And they want to know the number, and I’ve been working on different ways to really define that. And that’s what we’re looking at is building a dashboard that will fundamentally tell you based on different API’s and these metrics that here’s a little bit of a range, but this is what it’s going to take to produce, to get there. And I think that that’s what everybody’s asking for, so that’s really what I’m working on developing. And then I’m going to do a mastermind group middle of next year and I’m going to roll that out to the first-

Chris Burress:

To other agencies.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, to other agencies and let them know. And that’s really the process that we’re starting to teach our account managers. And fundamentally, here’s exactly what you need to do, here’s how many pieces of content you need to create, here’s the content that your competition is doing. And so it’s not me giving them the number, it’s me giving them the activity and then tying it to the number to say, “Hey, if you want a rank, here’s what everybody…” Because it’s all relative to what everybody else is doing. It’s not in a vacuum and it’s not like me Google, hey I’ll put you at the top. That’s maybe why a lot of people like to run ads because you guys kind of skip the line. Those are kind of coupon hunters, like the real value is in SEO, but there is value in that PPC and that’s a little bit easier to define. But to get you in first position organically, there’s so many different things that we look at, like domain authority, how many leaks, the age of the domain.

Matt Bertram:

I can go on and on and on, but it’s really, really hard to define that. And so I have given a couple of clients a number and I’ve made sure that number’s high enough to accomplish those goals in the amount of hours that we need to put in, and we have hit that number. But what I’m seeing now too is more and more people are spending money to compete for those numbers and that number is getting bigger and bigger, and so I got to provide better justification of why it’s going to take that much money to hit that number. And also it would be cool-

Chris Burress:

And exactly what we’re going to do in order to accomplish it.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, I mean you got to tie that into it, but then looping that back and going, “This is why it costs that much money, okay.” And explain that out to them. So I think that that’s just kind of fundamentally where it’s going. We’re becoming more data scientists, but also you’re becoming like human behavior psychologist to understand, okay if we get the traffic then once they’re there are they converted? Because we got a couple of sites that they’re absolutely got the traffic and the site’s not converting and there’s some things with the on-page analytics we’re really untangling. That’s really something we should probably charge extra for because that’s not SEO at all. That’s actually a fundamentally different discipline, skillset, to do that. And so really internet marketing, multichannel marketing is so important and I think social media is playing a really unique role and fundamental change in how people are interacting right now.

Chris Burress:

One of the things that I wanted to add from the conversation today that I thought was really interesting, I had never really thought about, it was related to backlinks, and we always do competitive analysis. So where are your competitors? Where are their backlinks? Because that’s an obvious easy way, lots of easy wins can happen that way. Had never really thought about if you’re targeting one keyword, what are the backlinks that your competitor has for that one key word?

Matt Bertram:

Not just overall links this time.

Chris Burress:

Yeah, not overall links because that’s where you really want to start and focus most of your attention. And that was something that’s in this kind of software that we’re excited about is delivered to you. So like, hey, you want to rank really well for, I don’t know, ESS60 and you look at there are some competitor out there, I don’t know, called My Vital C that’s outranking you for ESS60. Then the way to get it is like, well, what are the links that My Vital C has to their page that’s focused on ESS60 or placing well for ESS60? And then go after those first.

Matt Bertram:

So Ubersuggests, okay Neil Patel’s a tool, which I’m sorry-

Chris Burress:

By the way, he invited me to LinkedIn. Did you?

Matt Bertram:

He did hit me on LinkedIn too. Like yesterday or today or this morning.

Chris Burress:

He hit both of us.

Matt Bertram:

You first. But basically I think he’s going to charge for that tool-

Chris Burress:

Should we say no? Should we say no to Neil Patel?

Matt Bertram:

Basically he shows the average domain authority of people on the first page combined with how many total links that they have.

Chris Burress:

And content.

Matt Bertram:

Well he doesn’t share the content breakdown, but he just kind of gives you an overall summary, which is quite helpful, okay. Really what I have seen is everybody wants to go after that big core keyword that has all the volume. Just give it out here-

Chris Burress:

The customer walks in the door and “Give me first page for Houston Plumber.”

Matt Bertram:

Well I did that, but…

Chris Burress:

You gave him a quote and you did it, and then-

Matt Bertram:

Okay, fair enough. But so basically what the strategy though is, it’s because a lot of clients are coming to us when the pain is so strong that they’re like, “I have to rank and you got to make this work immediately.” And a lot of these-

Chris Burress:

“Here’s my last $5,000 or $10,000.”

Matt Bertram:

Well, we’re not taking anything under 10, period. So the thing is the time to hit that keyword is unrealistic. And the people that they’re competing against is, it’s unrealistic. It’s just unrealistic to go after that, that’s the wrong strategy. So what we’ve done is really start to do the research on the long tail key phrases where we can pick up where it’s not as competitive, where we can pick up some really, really targeted intent-based searches that are 30, 40 a month and then start to get two or three good leads here. And if we can knock that out, knock that out, knock that out with some fun little stuff-

Chris Burress:

And multiple phrases.

Matt Bertram:

It’s going to start to add up. And then basically you kind of surround that targeted keyword with all these other well placed kind of long tail phrases, then the authorities there to go after the keyword you want, but that’s like a longterm strategy. And that’s really what I’m seeing more than anything else is execution is 90% of the game, okay.

Chris Burress:

Get that job done.

Matt Bertram:

So you got to have the right strategy, but you’ve got to get it done and you got to get it done quickly and efficiently, and that’s pretty difficult so you’ve got to have kind of both pieces to it. But also too, if you’re working off the wrong strategy, oh my gosh-

Chris Burress:

Working off of the wrong strategy is like sending traffic to a page that is not going to convert, or spending all your time on having an amazing converting page and not having any traffic to it. Ultimately you’re going to end up with the same result, which is not very good, without the strategy.

Matt Bertram:

I’m just seeing more and more how a lot of teams that are coming to us, some are coaching, a lot of agencies and contractors that are working with companies like One-on-One, their tactics are good but they just need to refine their strategy a little bit more, maybe focus their strategy a little bit more, incorporate some different tools into what they’re doing. And then it’s kind of like a circuit getting plugged in and electricity running throughout. And that’s just kind of what I’m seeing is this kind of multichannel approach. I know you wanted to talk about social media.

Chris Burress:

We haven’t really talked about that yet.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah we haven’t talked about social, we’re talking about SEO because this is The Unknown Secrets of SEO. The SEO Podcast.

Chris Burress:

The SEO Podcast, Unknown Secrets of Internet and Marketing.

Matt Bertram:

Unknown Secrets of SEO. Let’s shorten it, we’re shortening everything.

Chris Burress:

We obviously did that change, it’s had a couple of different titles.

Matt Bertram:

What are we doing? I don’t know.

Chris Burress:

We’ve been through a couple of podcast title changes.

Matt Bertram:

We have?

Chris Burress:

Yeah.

Matt Bertram:

What was the other titles?

Chris Burress:

I think it was just The Unknown Secrets of SEO, was the beginning and then you do the search and there’s more search volume for internet marketing, and then we didn’t want to lose the SEO because…

Matt Bertram:

What about the Best Marketing Podcast? That has more search.

Chris Burress:

The Best Marketing Podcast. Does the best marketing podcast have more-

Matt Bertram:

Marketing podcasts have actually… You’re just going up channel.

Chris Burress:

Yes, so internet marketing, the SEO podcast.

Matt Bertram:

So you’re like SEO and then marketing, or no, internet marketing. Well I guess internet marketing has marketing in it.

Chris Burress:

It does have marketing in it. Now, the podcast might be in the wrong spot, so there’s some debates. That’s why we have the domain Best SEO Podcasts.

Matt Bertram:

I like it. I don’t want to change that.

Chris Burress:

You don’t want to change that?

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, I like that.

Chris Burress:

I think that’s good. And especially I think that was confirmed for you when you were at that event in New York with all those other agencies in the room and none of them are doing SEO.

Matt Bertram:

Yeah, nobody’s doing SEO because it’s a moving target. And we’ve got to really stay on top of it. They’re also calling it search.

Chris Burress:

Oh, it’s just search?

Matt Bertram:

It’s just search now. SEO is a bad word.

Chris Burress:

It’s what sounds too complex and we’re trying to simplify it and it’s just not-

Matt Bertram:

It’s like the Facebook.

Chris Burress:

Yeah, it’s just Facebook. The reality is that it’s a really complex thing-

Matt Bertram:

And it’s getting more complex.

Chris Burress:

It’s constantly changing. I think it’s easy for one person to do SEO on one site. That’s not that challenging.

Matt Bertram:

Well, you can’t scale it. That’s why a lot of agencies… I mean I had an agency owner of a really large agency that listens to the podcasts, you know who you are, you told me that your kids know my voice, which-

Chris Burress:

Our voice? Your voice, they just know you?

Matt Bertram:

Well, yeah I think I got the better mic.

Chris Burress:

You do have the better mic.

Matt Bertram:

Well he was only talking to me so that’s why he probably… Chris, you’re always in the conversation.

Chris Burress:

I’m always there, yes I am.

Matt Bertram:

But anyways, he said that the agency just left that he founded and blah blah blah.

Chris Burress:

A good sized agency.

Matt Bertram:

Very good size agency. Basically they do cookie-cutter kind of campaigns for SEO, they focus on PPC because it’s scalable. And really Facebook ads, PPC, that is where I got started. That that is where a lot of people get started. Once you move into SEO it gets a lot more complex, you need more people, you need more tools. A lot of people that are doing one service or one business every time you add kind of different things, it gets more complex. We do more than just SEO. We have a full videography team, we do website builds. It adds more complexity. But SEO in itself is the most complex and we have the most people dedicated to tripping those 250 plus different signals, but social.

Chris Burress:

Very true. So let’s talk about, I mean we could split this up into another podcast. Let’s do that. I think we covered a lot of SEO. I think we talked a lot about kind of the software we’re excited about. We’ll keep that kind of low key and I think we should wrap up this podcast at this point, I think that makes a lot of sense. Despite what I said in the beginning of this podcast, it was not about social media and things that we’ve done in the past what we’re doing, the next podcast will be about this. This is podcast number 468. So what I’d like to say is if you like this podcast we’re going to ask you to do three things, and that is share this podcast with three people, one, two, three. When you go share that podcast, share it to somebody who maybe is doing marketing or small, medium sized business that’s looking to grow and go ahead and share our podcast.

Chris Burress:

If you are looking to grow your business with the largest, simplest marketing tool on the planet-

Matt Bertram:

The internet.

Chris Burress:

Call eWebResults for increased revenue in your business. Our phone number is (713) 592-6724. Remember if you have a referral, somebody who you know who’s interested in internet marketing and you send them to us, then they pay their bill because they’re getting great service, we pay you or-

Matt Bertram:

And we actually have a lot of that going on. We have a lot of really solid referrals, we’re starting to become a bigger agency and measuring a lot of things, and referrals is one of the big sources of new business for us. If you’re out there and you’re working at a bigger company and you listen to this podcast, hey, reach out to us. Let us know that you like what we’re doing. If you think we could help your company, maybe you can make an introduction to somebody in leadership that can make a decision. There are a lot of agencies, well I guess there’s a lot of bigger companies I mean, that are starting to put a line item in for search engine optimization for social media management, they’re starting to see the value of internet marketing in general.

Matt Bertram:

And so you can take action. If you don’t feel that you’re in the position to make that decision, if you know somebody, please make an introduction. And same thing goes, we can work something out, make sure it’s based on your company guidelines, that sort of thing. But we’ll take care of you. So if you do have a referral or your company is doing marketing and you think they would benefit from maybe a strategy session or customer journey, a target persona, or if you’re having problems in different areas, we do email automation, we do a lot of different things, connect us with the right person and we’ll find some way to show you our gratitude.

Chris Burress:

To show you some love. Please remember we are filmed live here at 13105 Northwest Freeway, Suite 515.

Matt Bertram:

So when we launch our new website we’re changing just everything, all our listings. It’s going to be a big deal.

Chris Burress:

77040. If you would like a transcript, audio or video of this podcast you can look for it on Best SEO Podcast.

Matt Bertram:

bestseopodcast.com, we will be syndicating out across all major platforms.

Chris Burress:

You guys have made us one of the most popular internet marketing podcasts on iTunes. We appreciate you. Thank you guys for tuning in. Thank you for your five star reviews. Thank you for everything that you do. Until the next podcast, my name is Chris Burris.

Matt Bertram:

My name’s Matt Bertram.

Chris Burress:

Bye-bye for now.

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