Should you use Yahoo or Bing PPC in your Internet Marketing? What to do before SEO? - Unknown Secrets of SEO E-Webstyle Number 22

Hi, and welcome to the Unknown Secrets of SEO Podcast. Welcome back, and thank you for joining us for another fun-filled edition of the podcast. My name is Chris Burris, owner of eWebStyle. And this is Paul Hanson, sales manager of eWebStyle. So, as always, we like to start off with a little bit of... Do we start off with news, or do we talk about what we did last time first? I don't remember. I should know this, because we do it every week. Well, let's talk about a little bit of news. We have something that's absolutely, unbelievably hilarious. Man, fatally gored in Running of the Bulls. I have no sympathy for that guy. Well, I am kind of kidding. It's not absolutely hilarious. It's just stupid. Yeah. Stupid to me, you know. I think, have you heard of the Darwin Awards? I have, like, people who died doing, like, stupid stuff. Really, really stupid things. I think Running of the Bulls would be one. You were saying you had a buddy. Yes, and he had a great strategy. He ran track in high school and college, and he says... So, he was fast. Yeah, and he said when they said go, he immediately went to the front and did not turn and look back. And I'm like, hey, that's a good strategy, because if there's a 2,000-pound bull trying to kill me, I don't want to be... I don't want to hit it in the head. Taunting you, yeah. Yeah, with a newspaper. Yeah. No. You hit flies with a newspaper. You don't hit bulls with a newspaper. That's just kind of foolish. I'm sure it was a ton of fun until the point that somebody got hurt, you know. Yeah, it's always fun until somebody dies. I mean, it's hurt. It's not even going to get a lung poked out or whatever. You know, I'd love to have some great box seats for the Running of the Bull. I don't think I need to participate. That'd be cool. I think it'd be great to watch. Yeah.

Yeah, that'd be fun, but... Drink some nice Spanish wine. Of course, and then I'm definitely not running. Maybe even, like, throw a newspaper at the bull. I'll hand newspapers out, like, cups of water at the marathon. You seem out of paper. You need some defense. I'll just hand out newspapers. Here you go. Here you go. Don't mind that big 2,000, two-ton bull behind you. Or, better yet, hand out insurance. I should say insurance. Well, no, you know what? If Jackie Chan can beat up five guys with a rolled-up newspaper, certainly a random stranger can take care of a bull. A bull? Come on. Or, a sea of bulls running behind you. Yeah, I never... How many bulls run in... I don't know. It's at least 10. Oh, okay. At least 10. And do you get any head start? Do you... I just don't know anything about that. I don't know. I really don't... I mean, they geese... At least get, I'd say, 20 yards, but... Yeah. They run right in front of them. And then some of them, like, slow down so that they can wait for the bulls. Yeah, they do. They run right in front of those suckers, which apparently isn't a good idea. Yeah, on some occasions. The other thing we saw on the news that caught both of our eye, it was actually on MSN and CNN's front page, psychics see magic in Michael Jackson's life. Oh, man. That's newsworthy right there. What? So these are supposed to be... Is it a slow news day? Am I missing something? Aren't these supposed to be credible news sources? And we're talking about psychics. Yeah. Right. I have to tell you, I did use a psychic once. I've never used one. It was very valuable because I was sitting at the desk one day and I got this phone call and this lady said, yeah, I'm calling about life insurance. And I said, no, I don't need any life insurance. And she said, of course, according to her script, she said, well, we're

all, you know, uncomfortable talking about death and it's really not for you. It's for the ones you leave behind. And I said, no, really. I just got back from my psychic. I'm not dying for at least 10 years. So you're good. It went quiet. I mean, what do you say to that? That's what she said. She said, okay. Thank you. I'm going to use that one. I'm going to use that one. I think you could probably use that for anything. My psychic just told me I don't need that or whatever. That's awesome. Well, on our last podcast, we talked about, we kind of related how Michael Jackson was on the forefront of a technology. In that case, it was videos and, you know, how there are a lot of people right now on the forefront of Facebook and Twitter. We kind of told you how foolish I was to think we were on the first page in an instance where we weren't. Certainly, we're moving towards the first page on that. And we also talked about, this may sound funny, but burritos and hammer pants. Burritos and hammer pants. I mean, what better way to start a podcast? So if us talking about burritos and hammer pants intrigues you, you should go back to our previous podcast and listen to it. Because why, and you probably think, find out why we're talking about burritos and hammer pants on a SEO podcast. Exactly. So go back and check that out. Again, we love all your comments. We really appreciate everyone out there listening. If you've got any comments or questions for us, go ahead and send those to podcast at e-webstyle.com. We'll be happy to air your question and maybe even talk a little bit about your website and give you one of those shout-outs. Yes. And keep the emails for the analysis coming. Yeah. We're still extending our offer. We're still offering it. You can get a free five-point analysis. And that's from an SEO perspective, which as you, you know, if you've been listening

to this podcast, there's a lot of nuances about SEO, but the real value comes when you start actually converting that traffic into dollars. So that five-point analysis really attacks both of those. It's an analysis of your website from the perspective of turning traffic into customers and an analysis of your website to get it on the first page of Google, Yahoo, or Bling. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I'll go with Bling. They should have actually named it Bling. I like Bling better. You know, if they were more cutting edge, Microsoft feels like an old stodgy company now, right? That's true. Remember when it was the bomb? When it was what Apple is now. Or Google. Yeah, or Google. And Google's coming out. They're actually going to go head-to-head with a Google operating system, which is already available. You're looking stunned. Wow. I had read that. I didn't read too many articles on it, so I don't know too much about it. And it's clear that Google is, you know, its end game is, hey, anyone can sell somebody a device that has the ability to do computing. The only software you need to run on that, which sometimes people call that the operating system, is Google, and that's internet capable. You've got Google Docs. You've got Google Apps. You've got, you know, Google Drawing, Drafting, Editing. You've got everything you need in one Google app called Chrome. That's going to be interesting. I'd like to see where that goes. So we'll see how that goes. We've got a whole lot of things to talk about today. We're actually going to do a review of a website, which means that I need to pull that up, and I'll do that here shortly. But we started talking about, we've been running some different campaigns here. I like to really get involved in some of the campaigns sometimes. We've got lots of campaigns going off on places, and I kind of glance at them from time to time. But I take a personal interest in them sometimes, and things that

I, as I'm doing that, I kind of, it refreshes my mind about things that are probably valuable for you guys to think about. You know, one of them is pay-per-click. You know, we always talk about pay-per-click. It's valuable. There's value in running pay-per-click and having great organic search engine placement. Yes, definitely. And that comes from a perspective of, okay, I'm looking organically, which I trust, 80% more than pay-per-click. Yes. And I also noticed that they have a link over there on pay-per-click. So these guys are serious, not only about the quality of their website and information available on their website, they're also serious about their business and growing their business. So it lends to credibility back and forth. So you're certainly hoping that they see you're organic and then don't go click your pay-per-click because that costs you money. And you've already paid your money for organic if you've been working with us. Well, so everyone, when you talk pay-per-click and we talk in general, we're always talking about Google. And one thing that I want to make, I think it's very important to really think about is that Yahoo is another significant search engine out there. And if you got a click for the term, I don't know, Shudders in Houston from Yahoo, and you got the same click from Shudders in Houston on Google and you paid a certain amount of money, the value of those clicks is the same. A click is a click, whether it comes from, yeah, a search engine click from Google is just as valuable as a search engine click from Yahoo or Bing. So a click is a click. You know, you just want to get them to your, you want to get them to your website, what search engine they use, hey, whatever. Right. A click is a click. So they have the same value, but it's important to understand that they don't have the same cost. Oh, so that's an interesting point. And that's something that I think a lot of people can gain a

lot of valuable insight from. Let's talk about the cost. Now, when I think search engine, I don't even say search engine most of the time. I say Google because I think, I mean, Google is my go-to, that's my go-to search engine. So I usually go with Google. And so if I'm going to do a, if I'm Joe the Plumber, I'm starting a PPC campaign. Joe the Plumber again. He comes. Yes, all right. He's, I'm probably going to go to Google first. So talk about, you know, different search, like using different search engines and pricing. Talk about that. So, um, I think I will. All right. I appreciate it because if you don't, I don't know where, uh, where, where this bug is going. Um, so it's important again, you know, they have pay-per-click campaigns. They've got Yahoo, they've got Bing, they've got Google. Um, and what, what you realize is that Yahoo is less expensive. And if you're able to spend your entire budget at Yahoo, then you might as well spend your entire budget at Yahoo because you're going to get more clicks from the, your dollars at Yahoo or Bing than you are from Google because Google is more expensive. And I can give you some examples. Some of the terms that we're working right now for eWebStyle, you know, we're not getting clicks at the $5 range on Google and we are getting clicks at the $1 and $2 range on Yahoo. So, you know, every time Google clicks, it's costing us $5. Every time Yahoo clicks, it's costing us $1. I'm spending more money, attempting to spend as much money as I can on Yahoo because I get more clicks for the dollars. But wait, Chris, Google gets a lot more searches than Yahoo. You're right. But if I can spend all of my money, I'm getting more clicks. So if Yahoo has a significant amount of traffic, that's probably what you're alluding to. It's not like Yahoo doesn't exist. Uh, it's, you know, Google is significantly larger through probably three

terms, three times larger in terms of search searches. But if one, if the amount of traffic that Yahoo generates and the amount of queries that they generate relative to your, you know, search engine optimization Houston term is enough to spend all the money that you want to spend in that budget, then you should do it at Yahoo. And you do it at Yahoo because for that, we'll just say, you know, whatever, $10,000. For that $10,000, if you can spend all of it, you're going to get more clicks. Because your clicks cost an average of a buck a piece versus five bucks a piece. Excellent point. So it's, it's, it's not that Google in terms of searches, it's not that Google has, um, more influence. If somebody uses Yahoo for that person, Yahoo has more influence. And that, I like that. Right. Like Google doesn't have more influence. On the individual searchers. I like that a lot. They have influence in, you know, in the search realm and they have more people who prefer Google searches, but the people who use Yahoo use it and like it and like the results and are happy with it and they understand organic. I mean, they, you know, they may not understand organic, but they typically understand just like most Google users that the top is sponsored ads, that the right is sponsored ads. And, and those are people who are playing, paying for those positions and they understand, you know, if I click there, somebody's probably going to try and sell me something. Um, and if you're a Yahoo-er, then you're a Yahoo-er. If you're a Googler, you're a Googler. And if Yahoo, again, the bottom line is if Yahoo brings enough search and enough clicks to, to, to use up your budget, probably that should be generating income for you. So you need to be doing it on Google also, but it's possible there are, I'm sure there are business models where the $5 on Google isn't profitable enough. And the $1 on Yahoo is. And so

if you, if you were forced to grab your clicks from Google, you'd be in a world of hurt. Yes. Because, you know, then your, your cost per click is, uh, your cost per customer is skyrocketing. And I, I love this example because I think a lot of people out there, and even myself included, are just addicted to Google. Cause you just see Google everywhere and you hear about Google and you use Google. And I think a lot of people will overlook, um, Bing and, and Yahoo because they know everyone, I think everyone knows that Google is the king of search engine. You know, they have more, um, search traffic than anyone else out there. Uh, but just because they get more searches doesn't mean that they're more, um, they have more influence over the visitor. So don't, don't count out Yahoo and Bing. They can still be great places to get, uh, traffic for your pay-per-click campaign. And I don't want to say across the board, I think it can at, at times be, um, less cost. Clicks can be less costly. Yeah, absolutely. And we found that in a couple of, in a couple of situations. So that's why, again, you know, sometimes I don't get to get into the nitty gritty of these campaigns here at the company. And when I do anything that it kind of pops into my head, I want to share it with you guys. So, uh, so, you know, sharing that information is what we do. We're here, we're here to give back to the SEO community. So, and I think if I could jump in one, I think, um, I, this was a while back on a couple of phone conversations. I've talked to people and I've heard people say something along the lines of, well, I just want Google. That's, that's all I reuse. That's all I really care about. And I, I wish I could have had this revelation a few, uh, months ago because I'm sure this guy is probably doing his PPC on

Google and probably spending twice what he could have, you know, twice what he needed to spend using other search engines. And, and another way to, to put, to put that is for the same spend that he's spending on Google, you could have got a lot more clicks on Yahoo. Yeah. And, and, and there is a point that maybe you saturate Yahoo and you're still willing, you know, if, if your budget's 10,000, maybe you can only spend 2000 on Yahoo and because that's using all the available clicks and you're using pretty liberal terms and, and you're using content search capability and, and you're using all of this and you're spending only 2000. Well, if you've got another 8,000 to spend, you need to go over to Google for that. So, uh, don't count out Yahoo and we do, you know, I, I, I hope we do a good job of, you know, telling you we are always talking about Google and, but don't forget about the other search engines. There's more than one search engine out there. Yeah. Bling without the L is, is still a search engine. Um, and, and, and, and then I think we may even do a podcast, um, specifically, you know, how do you target stuff on, on being next time. So, uh, make sure you're subscribed to our podcast. Uh, you can get to our, our website at e hyphen web style.com. Uh, and there's a couple of ways to subscribe. If you click the web design, uh, link, uh, on the right there, there's a couple of ways that you can subscribe. And if you're subscribing, maybe this may sound weird, but maybe people are listening to it on our blog and they actually want to subscribe. And so those are ways to do that. Not everyone who's listening is actually subscribing to our podcast. No. Come on. Is that, how is that even possible? If you're listening, you need to subscribe. Come on, just admit it. You love us. You want to hear more from us. We love

doing this. And by the way, talking about the podcast, there's an, I had an interesting, um, experience with our podcast. You know, search engine optimization, and as you're moving, you know, historically, and we've talked about this as a company, we really haven't done much internal search engine optimization. And again, we're like the mechanic who drives the crappy car. He doesn't get paid to fix his car. So he doesn't fix his car. Yeah. We get paid to manage other people's campaigns. We don't get paid specifically to manage our own camp. In fact, we don't get paid to manage our own campaign. That's just a way of generating customers. And we made the decision a while back that we wanted to do that with, with the sales team, which Paul's putting together and, and do it, you know, more on a, on the, on the phone and a face-to-face experience. Because, you know, a lot of people aren't that comfortable on the internet, aren't that comfortable, aren't comfortable enough to really go out and research and find the information that they need. So that was a decision we made. Consequently, we put up this podcast, we started doing that, and I started spending a little bit of time on our own website in terms of search engine optimization. And we did some looking around and we found the terms that are relevant for us and highly searched is not SEO, because most people don't know what SEO is. It's actually things like internet marketing or internet advertising or website marketing, web marketing, exactly. So we're working on pages and procedures to start capturing that traffic organically. And I was sitting down just this week with a friend of mine. He's got an Apple TV, which is a pretty cool device, by the way. I'd never actually seen one again. You explained it to me. It sounds awesome. Yeah, it's pretty cool. But I noticed podcasts. He was showing me photos that he had. And I noticed podcasts and I was like, hey, can you pull up our

podcast? And, of course, he looked at me weird because he doesn't know that we have a podcast. So we pulled up the podcast. And then he started kind of going over. You know, I was kind of querying him. How would you, hey, his name's John. Hey, John, how would you find us? You're like, what would you search in podcast to try and find somebody to help you with your search engine optimization? And he said things like internet marketing or whatever. Well, we don't show up in iTunes if you type internet marketing because it wasn't the term we were thinking about when we put together the description of our podcast. I even thought about changing the name of the podcast. I don't think that's a good idea because, you know, we are Unknown Secrets of SEO. That's great. We just need to, you know, incorporate some of those keywords, remember, it's always about the keywords, into the description of our podcast. Yeah. And, you know, for other people in other industries, and we've talked about other examples of this, you may know certain terms in your industry that other people don't. Like if the example that we've used in a few podcasts back was MEP. That stands for Mechanical, Electrical, and Plumbing Engineer. Great example. Yeah, you know, I had no idea what an MEP designer was, engineer was. I know what, everybody knows what a plumber is or a mechanical engineer is. And this client was able to, she educated me and said, oh, this is how, you know, other MEP people will search. They'll search for MEP. And, you know, however, if you need a plumber, you're probably not going to search that. So, you know, don't forget that your customers may not be as intelligent, may not be as educated in your industry as you are. And I think this is a great example where, you know, we just, It parallels SEO. So, we were thinking in terms of SEO for the podcast, mirroring

some other podcasts that we heard. And now we'll be tweaking that. So, that's pretty exciting to try to start, you know, you've got to go back your whole, you know, every piece of literature, everything that you do as a company has to kind of scream the same message. And so, we're having to go back, you know, we kind of changed our message because we realized the value of certain keywords. So, we're going back and, you know, realigning all of that. So, I think that's awesome. That's great. Anything else on pay-per-click? Because we've got, we did want to do a website analysis for you guys. We think there's some value in that. So, if you don't have anything else, I think that was it. All right. All right. So, we've covered, really, that's, what we're going to title that is pay-per-click branding. You know, don't forget about Yahoo. Positive effects, you know, you can actually, when you're doing branding, you can actually go with good organic placement and good PPC placement. They can actually play off of each other and give you significant credibility. So, here we go. Here's an analysis. So, this guy, he submitted a form. Yes, submitted a form. Oh, FYI, if you're going to submit a form, please remember to submit the web address. Okay. The domain. The domain. Okay. Because he asked for an analysis of his website and didn't give me his website. And I just had to kind of figure it out. But he was asking for an analysis. Did you use Google to figure it out? Oh, yes, I did. I am so prejudiced against search engines right now. I've got to work on that. I did, I Googled him and I did find him. And he was asking, hey, I'm, his story was, hey, I'm a one-man show. I operate out of my house. I do have a website. It was built by a company. I'm not very happy with the website and I'm not really, but

more importantly, I'm not really happy with my traffic. Okay. Take a look and tell me what you think. Yeah. So, you took a look and your first reaction was, oh, my. What the punch this guy in the face. Oh. So, we've talked on a number of occasions about what are called splash pages or intro pages and they're fancy flash pages that come in and out. And we thought there was nothing worse than that, right? And at a minimum, you've got to have a skip button. Yeah, I mean, please, like this, I mean, I just, I really, really, really don't like them. And I know some people do. And, And that's the ones with the high-quality graphics. Yeah, I mean, This website has a splash page. There's no motion. There's, you know, it's actually, it's a business card. It's like two pictures that my grandma took. Right. And a phone number. And I'm like, I mean, come on. The picture, it's not really quality pictures. And I'm just, I am really biased against splash pages. That's just me, though. I'm like, oh, don't do that. Because I want the information I'm looking for, like, right now. And then, again, you know, going back to, okay, I want the information right now. You look at this and at first glance, there's no way to get past it. There's absolutely no way to get past the first page. First thing I look for always is the skip button. There's a click-to-enter button kind of button, a little graphic. And it's like the same color as, As a shade that it's pictured on. And I think you did mention he sells shutters and blinds. So, okay, that would be the first thing that we'd want to fix. Because the last thing we'd want to do is make an effort doing search engine optimization and getting somebody onto the first page and have them have to struggle with this. And, you know, most people, when they see this, at least most

people that we are talking with, Okay, so at least with Paul and me, we see this. We're not going to click to enter. We're going to click to leave. I'm going to bounce. It's a bounce. So that would be our first thing. Not only that, as soon as you get into the website, his first and most predominant link is to get back to the splash page. I don't want to see your splash page. I didn't like it the first time. So why are you making me go back to it? Come on. Oh, God. Okay. But to his credit, he did not design his site. Yes. Someone else did. Gosh. Who was it who designed his site? You know, it was a Yellow Pages publisher. And we're not going to give their name, but their initials are AT&T. And I think you probably figured it out. Yeah. And they're really good at slapping up websites really quickly. Yes, they are. Yes, they are. And they slap this one up really quickly. And it does have some of the components that you want. I actually do like this first image. It's got some of the cheesier stuff that we used to use when we designed long ago, like, you know, his plantation shutters, only $17.45, limited time, wiggling back and forth at the top. Looking like a seizure. Yeah. We always like to have motion, but you're right. We don't want it to be seizure-inducing motion. And that's kind of, it's actually just kind of annoying. Yeah. Just, you know, you want to stay away from anything that's like seizure-rific. In a way. Yes. I like it. That's Caesar-rific. Throwing me into the Caesar. So the other thing you notice is the links across the top. It's obviously a template that was designed to have six links, and he only has four. So they just left two blank spaces. One thing I will give him, his navigation scheme is consistent. And I was like, okay, he does have the same. If you go across every single

page, his navigation bar across the top that has links to his other pages like home, services, contact us, splash. It does stay consistent throughout the, which is, which, I mean, it's. It's very good. That's actually. And it's not, it's not, it's not really a given yet. And like, you would think it is a given, but I still see a lot of sites, almost maybe one every other day where the navigation system may. It's poorly done. Yeah, or it may change, so. Well, we were looking at that other site earlier today where it's just incomplete navigation where from the home page, if you clicked portfolio, it would go to the portfolio. But if you went to the services page and clicked portfolio, it was a dead link. Yes. And those are the kind of things that would cause us, you know, our rating system is from one to five. That would bring you, you know, from a five being the most powerful down to a two. Yes. Because some of your links are missing and then images were missing on that one. Yes. But, you know, for what he does, if you really think about it, and it depends on what he wants to do with his business, this is where we start asking questions about what do you want to accomplish with your business? Is it just some income? Are you happy with the current income? Is it something, and, you know, this may sound obvious because, you know, you think business owner, are you happy with the current income? There are a lot of people who are. Yeah. I mean, it's a legitimate question. There are people like, okay, I make, you know, whatever it is my company makes and I'm happy with that. I've got my car paid for. I've got my house paid for. My kids are going to college. I don't need any more money. I just need to maintain that business. And in this economy, to maintain a business, you need to be effectively trying to grow it. Yeah. Because

you are going to lose customers in this economy. We hear about it every day. And, you know, you've got to replace those customers. And to do that, you've got to be kind of, in effect, you've got to be in an expansion mode. So you ask that question. Is this a business that he wants to grow more? Is this a business that he's happy with? Does he want to grow to the point where he's got, you know, 10, 20 employees? You know, what's his kind of vision? Because when you start where, when you understand where you want to end up, it's easy to figure out what you need to be doing today. What you need to do, yes. If he wants 10 employees in the next year, we need to aggressively change his website and we need to aggressively go after organic search engine placement. Not just in Houston. This one we'd recommend a local search where he's doing things like shutters in Houston, shutters in Baytown. For those of you who aren't around Houston, Baytown is just, you know, a surrounding city that most service companies are willing to drive to. That would also include, like, Conroe. It's a little bit far. You may want to do it. You may not. Humble, Tomball, those kinds of places. So, you would kind of target a campaign for those keywords and those local areas so that he could grow his business. And, again, that depends on what he's doing. He's actually doing some of it. You'll notice he does mention proudly serving Pasadena, Houston, Seabrook, Clear Lake, Deer Park, Bel Air, and the surrounding areas. So, that was, I'm not sure that that was an attempt at SEO. I think it was just an attempt at kind of. To say where he's serving, what areas he's willing to service. But I still think it's, it's still a great idea in terms of letting the customer know, hey, these are the areas that I'm willing to drive to and help service you. But also, even for the search

engine Spyder, now they've got another geographic location associated with your website. So, if I'm searching for shutters in Bel Air now, you know, a Spyder might be able to find you. Right. Yeah. And apply and show your page. So, that's very true. And so, really, I would ask him what he wants to accomplish. This website, I would get rid of the splash page and just have his home services and contact us button. I would probably put a little more pictures on his services because he literally has only one picture and he has only one picture on the home page. And I think I would put a few more. And I always like to have people in pictures. So, like somebody doing, you know, pretending to finalize the installation is a very powerful image. It's more powerful than just the shutters. And so, I'd want to do that. I'd probably want to have a couple before and after. Right. The more dramatic, the better. Yes. Because it's going to give you some more things. You also see he's got his email here and it's got an improper link on it. So, it's actually a proper link but just improperly laid out. One thing that I think is people should really start to get away from is he has an email address. He has a Hotmail account. A Hotmail account. There's nothing wrong. I have a Hotmail account. But my Hotmail account is not on the eWebStyle website. Right. It's, you know, it's at eWebStyle. And when you're doing business as eWebStyle, you do it as eWebStyle. And that creates a certain amount of credibility. And to me, it's just, I would do it just for credibility. Nothing else. And nothing else. Just credibility. I, looking at his site, I think he needs to add calls to action. I really only see one. Yeah. And it's the caesarific plantation service for $17.95. That's not even a call to action. That's just like, you know, it doesn't say call me. Yeah, it doesn't. Right? It doesn't say call

me anywhere. It does in the text, which is very small. So, there's a part of him that understands, look, I need to be telling him what to do. Call the experts. The other thing that he's got on here is for a limited time order. It must order by 630.09. Oh, 9. And that was about two weeks ago, a week and a half ago. So, you know, and then items available. He just needs to spend a little more time on the website to make it more impactful. And here's one thing I'd say. If you're going to put limited time offers and call me by this date, make sure you are updating. Because to me, when I see stuff like that, I'm like, okay, you're not really messing around with the website. And it's kind of ironic because that date, as soon as it expires, that could be 2007. Or it could be last month. The meaning is the same. They don't update their website. Exactly. Right? And if it's, you know, my belief would be that I could come back in a year and that's still going to say 630. So, I'm going to treat him just the same as somebody who's got an expiration by 630.07. So, you're right. It is very important to keep that up to date. And one thing that I would say is I think little things like this, like having maybe a Hotmail account listed on your website and having incorrect dates and broken links. To me, that is something, it's like one little small negative thing. Having a Hotmail account, it's not a sin to have a Hotmail account on your website. But it's one little bitty negative thing. Okay, maybe, you know, he should have his own, you know. You might let that slide. Yes. Okay, but now I also see a date, an expired date on here. Okay. You know, and then I also see another little bitty thing. And then those little bitty things adds up. And you don't want to, you know, having that, you

know, having the correct email address and having proper dates on your website is probably not going to get you a sale. But having these things improperly done on your website might lose you a sale. Yeah, it can definitely lose sales. And so it's just about making sure you're doing, doing what you're supposed to do, you know, is not necessarily going, you know, doing these things right could help you keep sales. Not necessarily, or help you not lose them, if that makes sense. So kind of the short story is, hey, if you're kind of happy with where your business is, you want to grow it a little, I would clean up this website just so that it's not damaging your reputation. Yes. Because it should be supporting your reputation. And then I actually wouldn't do SEO. So if he's happy with his business, just keep it manual because he's going to invest some money in SEO. Yes. And, you know, that's what he's going to do if he wants to grow his business. And I think he's going to have to invest some money in his website. Before we do SEO. And that's something we do talk about. So, and, you know, you may have, everyone listening, you may have to do that. Consider if you're going to do SEO, you might have to invest money in the website first. Yeah. So don't forget that. Because the last thing you want to do is waste money. That's like doing a mail out and having the wrong phone number. Exactly. Right? Because if they call and, you know, it's the wrong place or if they go to your website and it's the wrong image that, you know, it presents an image that doesn't represent your company, the high quality of your company, then, you know, they might as well have called the wrong number. Yeah. So you don't want to make those efforts without having a clean, good look and feel. So, we're actually out of time. Yes. I think we're a little over. Yeah. We're a

little over. You guys, look, no charge. These four minutes are free. Absolutely free. Brought to you by the guys at eWebStyle. eWebStyle, your SEO, which actually means internet marketing company. And keep the emails and the analysis. Analysis. Seizures. The analysis requests. Keep those coming. I love knowing that people are listening. They want help. And, you know, we are still going to extend it. We are going to offer it for free. And here's one thing I'd like to say. If you are listening and you have a podcast, send it to me. Yeah. I want to listen. I try the best as much time. I try to dedicate time to listening to other people. I don't have as much time. But I want to know who else is out there, who's got a good podcast. We might be able to learn from something that you put out there that maybe I didn't know. So send us podcasts, you know, or if you know of another one, send it to us. You know, I'd like to become your audience. You're listening to us. I'd like to become part of your audience as well. Excellent. Well, until our next podcast, this is Chris Burris. And Paul Hanson. Bye-bye for now.