SEO Podcast - The Best SEO Podcast Number 79

Welcome to the Unknown Secrets of SEO Podcast. What's up everybody? Welcome back to another fun-filled Friday. It's going to have a great podcast for you today. This is podcast number 79. You are listening to the most popular SEO podcast on iTunes. Thanks to you. Thank you guys very much. I've got some exciting news. We've got a review. We've got stuff going on. We've got a great photo here. We've got you. This is exciting. I'm thrilled. You seem under-thrilled. Under-thrilled. That's a new word. As always, we want to start off with a little bit of information about what we did last time. Remember, we're doing a tip of the podcast. Our last podcast. You guys are going to love this. And while you regular listeners are going to love this, don't be a social media douche. Don't be a social media satanic douche. Satanic douche. You just took it to another level. That's always happening here. That's what I remember from Chuck last week. That was, yeah, that was wrong. SD, watch out. We also like to cover a little news. I'm going to mix in some news and some listener feedback. Dean Calhoun was asking if we're heading over to South by Southwest. He wants to get a couple four-square badges while he's over there. What was pretty cool is he actually put four and then the carrot and two, which is four-square. And it took me a while. Oh, I still didn't get it. Four to the two? Yeah. Is he going to get a lot of them? Yeah. I was like, I just didn't get that. That's what's up. Yeah. That's four-square badges. So thanks, Dean. Our plan is to go. This will be the first conference that we go to. We're trying to figure out what we're going to do. We're going to broadcast a podcast from there, which would be just that off the chain. Cool. That would be really cool. Is it off the chain now? Because it used to be off the hook. I still say off the chain.

Okay. Because I'm off the chain. Because you are off the chain. That's what's up. And Jay Roulet, thank you so much. Charles spent about two hours on the phone with him talking about his internet marketing campaign here in Houston. Jay, frankly, is one of the most educated clients. He came in and basically he provided to us all of those things that we would normally give a client in a proposal. And we're like, thanks. Give us money. That'll be a check, please. No, we're going to do some great work for Jay. He's going to come in on Monday. So we're excited about forming that partnership. He's very serious about growing his business in a very serious and organized way. And it's awesome to work with that. Man, I got a Darren Bowie. He called me a zombie. Yeah, that's what's up. You know, I was going to wear, I forgot, I was going to wear my jacket. Because zombies don't wear jackets. And that way you can't do that shit ever again. Because that was hilarious. I was cracking up when I saw that. I was like, that's a perfect still shot right there. Like, I got to know, did he, was he watching it? And he was like, oh, I got to get that shot. Get a screen capture. He's going to look like a zombie or a divsy. I don't know. That was pretty cool. Thanks, Darren. That's awesome. He also did analysis. We're going to, you know, we're going to make our own comments on your analysis a little bit later today. I wanted to talk about this. We've got three more likes on Facebook. I didn't write down the number. 72 people following us on Twitter. By the way, you can stalk us, along with 72 other people. And you can do that by going to twitter.com slash eWebStyle. On Facebook, you can go to facebook.com slash eWebStyle. And there's no dash in that eWebStyle. You can also hit us up with an email, podcast at e-webStyle.com. We do have a free

analysis. We're still marketing. I mean, we're still offering this. Excuse me. We'll look at your website. We'll give you analysis from kind of a web perspective, you know, aesthetics and navigation, and also from SEO, which, frankly, we believe are all together. But we'll give you that analysis for free, and there's no obligation. Just hit us up. The easiest way to do that is now go to our website, which is new as of last week. That's why Darren made his comments on the right. Apparently, there is a garish form that you can fill out. But do you know what garish means? I have no idea. You just know it's not good, right? I was the same way. I just liked that you said it. That was pretty funny. I got to look it up, right? What it means is clothed in vivid color or distressingly bright or tastelessly showy. Okay. So, you know, we're proud of our garish form here at eWebStyle. So, watch out. Let us garify. We'll punch you in the face and garify your website. I don't know if that's garify is even a word. It is now. Yeah, it is now. It's in the Unknown Secrets of SEO Podcast Dictionary. We have another listener in Chile. Oh, that's what's up. Chile? Either that or our one listener in Santiago went and visited Antofagasta, Antofagasta, which is, you know, up the coast of ways, Chile. And it's actually pretty cool. By the way, this is how cool this place is. Check this out, Paul. You sent us a picture? No, I looked it up. Oh, that's hot. That's off the coast of Antofagasta. So, look at that. That's hot. That's very cool. That's like when you play Wii and you're flying around and you got to, like, go under that. They stole it from there. I've never played Wii, so. That's like when I play Wii. I played Wii Fit once. It was awesome, though. Yeah, Wii Fit. Yeah, that's good. I don't know how that would fit into Wii Fit. You know,

you got to swim around, swim through the loop and not die. That would be more like Wii Vacation. Wii Vacation. Wii, sit on the beach and chill and drink up here. Yeah, there you go. And watch the chicks go by. Okay, so a little bit of news. Firefox has an Android beta, so we know Charles is going to be all excited about this because he's the only Firefox guy here. I mean, we all use it, but he's like the, you know, when we have our browser wars, which by the way, I think would make a great reality TV show. I think so. I don't know how, but the title alone would draw tens of people. This is interesting. We're always, you know, whenever Apple's got some stuff going on against them, the Apple iPhone on the back, there's glass. I didn't realize this, but apparently when you put a case on the iPhone and then, you know, it's in your pocket and you get a little dirt, it starts scratching the glass and then those scratches propagate into full-on cracks and now you have a cracked back of your iPhone. That sucks. I did a whole big project on crack propagation, so if that sounded like I knew what I was talking about. I almost do. And then, you know, we never really talk about Microsoft and things that are going with Microsoft, but apparently in their latest patch, they are fixing 49 holes. Well, you have 49 holes in the first release. Yeah. Yeah. I mean, maybe that's a lot. Maybe we can do like Beavis and Butt-Aid. That's not much. Yeah, really. When they're at the dam. No, 49. Is this a goddamn? The 49 is probably not a lot for Microsoft. Probably way more than that. Yeah, it was 49 and it was patch number 356. We got a review on iTunes. That's what's up. And it is a long one. I don't know if this is going to do any more inter-office stuff. Auburn football. Oh, that's what's up. SEC football.

I'm a big-time college football fan. Get you some. All right. So, I love this line. This is Auburn football says that he's been playing in the internet since before Al Gore went off and invented it. Wow. You've got to love that. Because he is the inventor. His website is Blue Sheepdog. So, I don't know. I wonder if he needs any blue one-armed widgets to... We can match you up. We can coordinate that for you. He says it's amazing how... He's listened to a lot of old podcasts. It's amazing how much things have changed over the course of a few months. His only criticism is audio quality. Better mic. Like, I think we only had about two or three podcasts. I think these podcasts now, like this one, is actually good enough. But please give us feedback. Let us know. Because if I'm, you know, if I'm sitting in my quiet office when I'm kind of playing it and listening to it or whatever and it's not good enough for a car, hit us in the email, podcast at e-webstyle.com, because, you know, we want to make sure that you guys can actually hear the information. We're putting a lot of effort into getting information to you guys. We want to make sure that you can hear it. And then we got a subject. Yes. Subject of the day. Before we get into it, I found this article that we're probably going to talk about next week. But it's something... I just found it this morning. And it's something that I have... I had some questions about previously in doing my keyword research. And I know somebody else. Now, I wasn't... I just... I had questioned it, but I just didn't have enough to really think so. And I said, there's something going on with the Google Keyword Selector tool. And there is. I found out today. I read this article. It says, RIP Google Keyword Tool, Long Live SEO. And we'll get into... Well, we'll do this next week. But if you've been doing some

keyword research, Google has shortened the number of keywords that it will give you, right? And basically, I was like, this thing is starting to suck. And here's a term that I want to read. And it basically says, Google has decided marketers should no longer have access to the long or even mid-tailed data of search inventory unless the keyword has demonstrated commercial characteristics historically. So... Wow. Could you be more commercial characteristics? What is that? Like, from... AdWords. From our... Oh, AdWords. Basically, they're limiting their keyword research to shit they can sell on AdWords. I noticed that something was changing. I wasn't getting nearly the number of keywords that I was with the old tool. I found that article. And I'm like, wow. This makes a lot of sense. That's really interesting, though. Because, I mean, whether it's long-tail or what, I mean, if anybody happens to search it and there happens to be a sponsored list there, link there, and they happen to click it, I mean, that should be commercial for... I don't get it. I don't get it either. But basically, the guy who wrote it was like, it's probably profit-based. Yeah, yeah. We know that. As a perfect example, the guy put in, I have it in the article, he put in Facebook, and Google returned 12... Facebook terms? That's it. And I was like, are you joking? 12? Right, because you could do Facebook... And it was like, he used another one, it came up 2,200 on another keyword tool. Oh, wow. And it was just showing how Google, like, you really think that people are only interested in 12 different versions of the term Facebook. Yeah, 12 aspects. I mean, we could probably rattle off 12 right now that aren't even on the list you came up with. Wow. I thought it was really cool. I noticed it, and I think that someone else is probably out there noticing it. And if you're using Google AdWords as a keyword research, this is going to have a significant effect on that. And

I am now looking for a new word tool, or search query tool. So if you guys have a favorite keyword research tool, let us know. We'd like to pass that information around. And, you know, if you have to pay for it, great. We'd love to see some review about it, and know that it's good if we're going to investigate it. Because, yeah. Yeah. If you're only getting 12 for Facebook... That sucks, man. How do we... Like, if we get a client in here who says, look, I want to market to Facebook people, and I want to market to them because, you know, I'm, let's say, effectively competition for them, then we're going to say, okay, great, you got 12 keywords. Google says that you should only be interested in 12 things. Yeah, no, so that's not going to work for our client. Yeah, man, that sucks. I'm glad I read it, though. It opened my eyes to something that I had questioned, but didn't have proof. All right, so I like the title of this article. It's called, Retargeting is the New Black, which... I guess. I mean, I heard... Should I say black hat? Like red, oh. I don't agree. There's something that said red is the new black the other day. Yeah, I was like, really? White is the new black. I don't know. That's weird. But today, retargeting is the new black. Yeah, apparently. And that's today as of October 6th. This article is by Kelly Gillies. I think I actually said that. Kelly Gillies. Kelly G. Kelly G. So this is a good article about retargeting, remarketing, what you're going to do with those articles. I mean, what is retargeting? Retargeting is something that I'm glad we brought it up, because retargeting and remarketing is something... What's up, out here? Hello, out here. Good morning. It's something that we're starting to... Nice jacket, by the way. Thank you. There we go. He said he stole it. That's Chris. Out of Chris's closet. That is a retargeting. He retargeted the jacket. Retargeting

or remarketing is something we're starting to get into in eWeb style. And it's something I'm starting to notice a lot more. So let's say you went to... You know, give your example of the web domain. I love that. This example is pretty crazy. So, you know, of course, we're often searching domains, and we actually use the interface. I mean, we purchase it from another wholesaler, but we use the interface of... I use their interface of register or sometimes network solutions, mostly register.com. And so I'm looking up this keyword, and later in the day, and we had had some conversations in the prior month about remarketing and retargeting. Later in that same day, because of those conversations, I was really aware of what's going on with the banner ads that I'm seeing. I don't remember what website I was on. It was just on another website. And it literally said, don't lose XYZdomain.com, which was the domain I had been searching. So not only did it remarket to me, it remarketed the specific domain name that I had been looking for. I mean, that was actually... I copied that. Actually, I took a screenshot and emailed it to everyone we've been having conversations about retargeting and remarketing, because how powerful is that? I think it's huge. I had a similar example about three days ago. I was on the Texas Renaissance Festival website, because I'm a weirdo like that, and I like that kind of stuff. And I went to the Chronicle.com yesterday. You have to get your Renaissance on? I do. The Houston Chronicle's website is chron.com. I go to it, and there was a banner for the Texas Renaissance Festival. And I was like, wow, okay, I just went there. No, I'm probably not going to buy a ticket this weekend, but they remarketed it to me. And that's remarketing, and here I'll read the definition from the article. It says, on the most basic level, retargeting slash remarketing is leveraging the visitor audience a site already receives to market more aggressively to that

qualified audience. Additionally, most marketers either exclude or specifically target visitors that have completed transactions versus those who have not. Even more complex targeting regarding what content visitors browse can be implemented with many retargeting solutions. So what websites that you're going to, what things that you're searching for, are all brought back to you at a later date on a website. And it's a very effective form of marketing. We've actually taken it on here at eWebStyle. When we talk to clients, we talk about phases. Like, okay, phase one is usually maybe stretching your current internet marketing budget a little bit, because most people are typically under budget for internet marketing. And then we talk about phase two, three, four, and potentially five, where, hey, this is where we're ramping up. We're proving effectiveness. Your business is growing. So we need to increase pay-per-click. We need to increase spend on SEO. And phase two is now incorporated banner ads, banner remarketing, because it's so powerful. I mean, they came to your website, which is some expression of interest already. We can govern the particular page that they went. We can know what particular page they went on. As a great example, in our blog, I have a lot of technical information. We do IT in and around the city of Houston. So I've got things about Citrix servers in our blog. I've got things about WordPress in our blog. And if somebody were to go, you know, end up on our website because they were searched a term about Citrix, we don't really want to remarket to those people, because they could be anywhere in the country, and Citrix isn't something that we focus on. We really only want to remarket to the people who have visited our internet marketing page, or our pay-per-click page, or, you know, one of our web design pages. And we potentially want to remarket to them differently, right? Hey, make sure you get the most awesome website. This is a great copy. Guys, you can't steal this. Get the most awesome website.

Don't miss out on the most awesome website if they went to our web design and development page. You know, things like that. So that's one of the powers of remarketing or retargeting. And Kelly calls it retargeting. We're familiar with, more familiar with the term remarketing, because you're marketing again to somebody who's already been marketed to. And retargeting. And I think it's great. It's proven that it's effective. It works. And now that I am, my eyes have been open to remarketing. My eyes were typically trained to skip advertisements, period. All advertisements. PPC, banner ads, everything. And now, just over the past, like, three or four months, I've retrained my brand. And now I see banner ads everywhere. And now I notice that I was just on that site two or three days ago or a half hour ago. And now they're remarketing to me. Now, one thing I would say, we've been throwing out a lot of stuff here lately. PPC and SEO and remarketing and email marketing and social media marketing. I would probably say, just like we said in last week, don't let social media should not come before search. Correct. And I think this is definitely true with remarketing. Yep. Get your search campaign down first. Once you have got that going or your campaign management company is doing a phenomenal job that we do, then, you know, start asking about remarketing. But I would say don't kick search out of the window for remarketing and social marketing. Get your search down first. Get your PPC. Get your SEO. And then do some remarketing. And there's some potential situations where, you know, if you're in a highly unknown business, and I think this is a pretty cool example. This week I went to a dentist. And I went to the dentist at, you know, this is exciting, right? I went at a dental spa. So, you know, they do facials. They do hand massage or whatever. The ambiance, the environment was very spa-like. They greeted me. They offered me wine and coffee. It's

a unique experience. Different than the, you know, fear-ridden, you know, shut up, sit down. I'm not going to knock you out this time because it's not going to hurt that much. And, you know, go after it. And so that kind of business needs to be marketed a different way. Certainly if anyone in Houston types in dental spa, they need to come up. But they also should be doing some marketing where, you know, some banner ad marketing where they're saying things, where they're branding, where they're educating the consumer about, you know, where you don't hate your dentist. The dentist you love, you know, or things like that. You know, I think that's a great idea. I never thought about it like that because I would probably, I've heard of a dental spa once probably in my life. But it's not something I would really search for. Or if it's a product I've never heard of, obviously I'm not going to search for it. Exactly. Because I didn't know, hey, but it showed up when I was at, you know, ESPN Fantasy Football. And that, you know, well, maybe dental spa is not a good example. But, you know, you get the point in life. Fantasy Football. Now I can go get my face off. That's right. And my nanny and petty. All for under 35 bucks. Right before I get my renaissance on. I got to have clean teeth. Right before I bust this dude in this fantasy football. Right before I punch my next customer. I want to have good breath and nice nails. I think branding is a great way to use to, or remarketing is a great way to do also branding. Because it's, you know, a lot of things I've just never heard before. And that's actually a guy that I talked about, the home builder guy. Right. He'd be a great example for it. I had a conversation with a guy who is a home builder, but he has a brand new way of building homes that's never been done before

using aluminum extrusions. And, you know, people don't search for aluminum extrusions built homes because they didn't know they'd do it. That's a great example. So, one thing to look, you know, one thing to watch out for when you are considering doing some remarketing, you want to do a cost comparison. There's a lot of different companies out there that do it. We do it. Double Click does it. Ad Bright, specific media does it. And we really think it should be part of a plan. Yeah. Right? It shouldn't, you know, if you're doing this all yourself, we understand, okay, that's, you know, why you're part of the reason you're listening to the podcast. Really, remarketing is part of an entire internet marketing plan that we really come up with kind of on our first conversation, which is here's phase one. Phase two includes some remarketing. Phase three increases budgets because we're getting good ROI, a little bit more remarketing, a little branding. Or, in the case of the dental spa, the branding, I mean, the remarketing and the banner ads are going to come in a lot earlier because not to, you know, you can't rely on search for something people don't have information about. So, I just wanted to throw that in. And that's very true. And so, when you're thinking about doing it, you want to take a few things into consideration. Obviously, the cost, the cost model that they're using. Is it pay? Is it cost per click type of model? You also want to look at the person's, the marketing company's reach. And basically, here's a line I'm going to steal from this. It says, retargeting solutions often vary in their network reach and partnerships, though there are many providers that have a greater than 90% reach and have quite a lot of network overlap. So, you want to get someone that has, and, you know, we actually have, I believe it's a greater than 90% reach, that we can get out to a larger market. Basically, it's saying you want to choose

someone that can find you anywhere, no matter where you are. Yeah, there's no reason to re-market if the only place they can re-market is fantasy football and you're, you know, doing dental spa. Exactly. Because, let's be honest, fantasy football guys probably never got to the dental spa in the first place. That they're admitting. That they're admitting, unless they go to the Renaissance. And they're comfortable with that. So, you know, there's no value in re-marketing on, you know, in that particular case, on that website. Yeah. So, you want to find a company that has a large, large reach that they can basically, you know, I look, they can find me anywhere. I go to the Texas Renaissance Fest website. And then I'm on, you know, joeblowmama.com. And they can find me there, no matter where I am on the internet. Is that a porn site? It kind of sounds like it. They're a reach. You want somebody to find a porn site? I was on that porn site the other day. We're going to re-market this Texas Renaissance Festival right on top of that. joeblowmama.com. He won't be distracted. You know what? We've been pontificating here long enough. We really should get a truly expert opinion on re-marketing and banner ads in general. So, you know who I'm talking about. The prince of social media? The prince? I said it. I had to give it a little shot. As long as he's not the satanic king of... Man, I left my haiku. I was going to be the king of social media. Oh, yeah. I was going to write a haiku. Yeah. No, I wasn't. That was just a terrible idea. I was just impressed that you brought in the word haiku. Yeah. You know, that's right. So let's bring in the social media master himself. He's also known as the SEO rapper. And he's helping us here out at eWebStyle often and in big ways. You can squeeze around the mic, maybe. High squeeze. Come on out here and give us your opinion on re-marketing

and banner ads. Doing it awesome. Oh, that was a nice little ballet dance. You love our staging, right? It was elegant for him. Well thought out. Great utilization of space. So what do you think about re-marketing? What do you think about banner ads in general? I think re-marketing... Well, first off, I used to hate banner ads, right? As you know. Me too. I think everybody did. But I think when used right with the right re-marketing campaign, then it can be effective. Yeah. And because I hate them. Right. Right? I hate them because they get my attention. I always look at them. I don't want to look at them. They're flashy. I might have to buy something if I look at them. I might like it and I don't want to like it. You know, cheap. And so in that case, it may work. Especially if you're re-marketing and need something that I'm interested in. So I already know he's going to have clean teeth, clean nails, foot and hand next week. He's already subject to the marketing we've been doing in this podcast. We're going to be the neatest, cleanest SEO-ers in the planet. Because we've got great Medicare. And I think it's funny how, like I didn't, I don't like them either. But when it's like, oh wait, it works and I can make money off of it? Yeah. Y'all made me in my house. It's so bad. You know, you hate it until you use it and you're like, oh yeah, I hate it. But it makes me, you know, X thousand dollars a month. So I don't hate it so much anymore. Yeah, I start promoting it. You got some good banner ads. I don't even know why you're on this organic section. Yeah. It's garbage. You need to go with that stuff. Everyone ignores banner ads. I also wanted, Charles, to give some input. You know, I mentioned earlier that Darren Bowie gave us kind of a critical analysis, not criticism, critical analysis of our website. Boy, do we appreciate it.

You know, he hit us up on Facebook and said, hey, are you interested? You know, I'm a big proponent of getting somebody's buy-in before I thrash anything they do. You ask for it. And, no, we really appreciate it. And I know Charles hit him back and said something to the effect that a lot of the negatives, excuse me, that you came up with were things that we were thinking about. And I wanted Charles to come in and kind of comment on those because I think it's relevant for our listeners to know, you know what, the first time we put up a website, that's why it's so important that SEO is a monthly service. It's Internet marketing is a month-to-month process. You know, you put up a website and then you get, you know, appropriate critiques, although Garish is a bit, you know, I don't know, it's a bit over the top. Well, shout out to Darren. He's watching right now. I'm most serious in case you was wondering. I was just chatting with him. Oh, okay. But, you know, truthfully, like you mentioned, it's a month-to-month thing. And with that being said, it's good to know that it doesn't have to be perfect. Right. At launch. Yep. Matter of fact, some of the updates that we'll be making throughout the next, you know, weeks and months will improve our ranking. Yep. Because we're tweaking them. Because we're tweaking. Google likes updated content. They like changes. I mean, so I look at it like this, you know, we were already getting a great rank with Houston SEO, right? Right. With the Flash. Right. Just to answer your Flash question. So, I won't say it helps, but it doesn't hurt like it did. Right. What is the Flash question? Well, he questioned, it was a pretty much simple question. Is Flash good for SEO? Yeah, and we've touched on this a number of times. And kind of the short answer is no. Yeah. And then the long answer is, well, if you use it judiciously. If you

overdo it. Yeah. If you use it judiciously, you're okay. If you overdo it and you've got lots of text content in Flash. And I think that question has come up a lot. Because who was the dude? Ben. Yeah. Said that yesterday. He was like, Flash, you guys do Flash? And I could tell, I felt like he asked it, like. Because he wanted it. Okay. Oh. That's the impression I got it. Oh, okay. See, I thought he was asking. He was like, uh, I hear Flash is not so good. I've been asked that a lot lately. So, I guess people are probably catching on to the Flash SEO. When you're not in the industry, you probably get kind of flashes of information. And the flash of information is Flash is bad. Right? It's great for aesthetics, but Flash is bad. Well, it's not that Flash is bad. It's that an all-Flash website is pretty much unindexable by the Google monster. It's how you use it. There we go. You sound more like a pirate. Okay, the Google Pirates. Shiver me a little. That was pretty good. I'm impressed. I want you to do a whole podcast in pirate. I would, too. I would. I really would. Maybe at, maybe at, uh, South by Southwest, Paul will be dressed as a pirate. Do you go as a pirate to your Renaissance Festival? No, I have friends. I'd like to keep them, you know? Because I have one of my homeboys here that I'd be like, dog, it's been real. Yeah. You don't ever call me again. Call me again? Seriously. The pirate thing at the rim? Nah. Nah. Not cool. Does he listen to the podcast? I had another question. He might even get out. Anyway, another question. One other comment was that our contact, uh, button, uh, contact us link looked like a PayPal button, a buy button. Interesting observation. Uh, did you want to click it? That's a good question. Yeah. You know? I mean, if you want to click it, then job well done.

Yep. And here's a great, uh, because we had already talked about that button a little. And my concern was, yes, it looks like a button and it has a phone number. So is it, does it, is it, does it appear to the user that it's a badge and they're not going to click it because it's a badge with a phone number in it? Or does it appear that it's a button with a phone number in it that they're going to click? And so I had thought about maybe the contact us being underlined so it looked like a hyperlink. Well, the objective is either one. Yeah. Call or click. Exactly. You know, if you click it, great. Fill out the form, which we'll be working on. I saw your comments about the form. Total agreement with that. Yeah. Garish, man. Come on, dude. You know, but you don't have to click it. Yeah, the other comments. Yeah, you can call. So, um, so I understand totally. Yeah, so we'll, we'll, we'll definitely be tweaking that. In fact, we even have, there's a couple things, uh, on the form that we're, we're probably going to do some A and B variant testing on just to see what's more effective, what gets more, uh, form submittals, uh, you know, and, and we'll throw this out there. You know, one of the concepts was, um, should the website be the first thing you fill out? Because if you start filling out a form, you know, people, we know that people are apprehensive about filling out forms. What they're apprehensive about is giving out their personal information. And so it might be easier for them to say, oh yeah, I'll get my website. Oh, I've already given my website. So I'll go ahead and fill in my name as opposed to, man, I don't want to give my name, you know? So they don't even get started on the form. So there's probably some value in that fact. We may even need to change it so that the website is

the only thing they put. And then they go to a second form where they fill out the rest of the information. That's an AB variant test for sure. Right? Yeah. We can test it. That's an interesting concept. Just from what I've learned though, you know, a lot of times sending people that extra click, that extra. You lose them anyway. Yeah. The double opt-in type deal. Oh yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Uh, I hardly ever double opt-in. Like you don't trust me. I, I filtered out. I said my email address. Now you want me to click on this link. Right. And it'll last more of your social now. Yeah. And some credit card information, just throw it in there. We'll, we'll call it, uh, card numbers, not credit card information. To go back to what y'all said, maybe I'm just having, I need to go through the site a little bit more so that we have a button to look like a badge. I do. I just need to, I need to, I thought I looked at it. You were laughing, but it's so true. Like how many people know what's, what's on their current website? And, you know, it's, you know, it's, you know, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, it's, but, and you did a great job and Javier, yeah, Javier rocks, Javier rocks. A great job. Somebody told me that. I meant to tell you both. Like, you got, like, the original design was great. The content and everything you did was awesome. Both of y'all. Uh, so we have a badge with our website in it and it's. It's not really a badge. It's more of a button. A button. So, is it questionable whether or not people can click on it and call us directly? Is that kind of where? Well, I think Darren's question was, the contact us button looks like a PayPal button, not a graphic. So, it's, I mean, Charles is going for it, it's got the phone number, it's like contact us now, and then it's got the phone number.

You can click it, it takes you to the contact us form. And so my concern was, okay, does it look like a badge, and they're not going to click it because it's a badge that has the phone number in it, or does it look like a button, and I think it looks like both. Yeah, and the reason for it is, we redid the navigation. Yeah. There is no contact link on the navigation. To keep it simple. And so I need to give them a contact place that's, you know, in the same, throughout the entire site, that's prominent, that'll take them to the contact page. Okay, that makes sense. And so, that's why it's there. And that's about simplifying content, you know, when we talk about SEVO, search engine visitor optimization, one of our key things is, it's got to be simple, you know, the more simple, the less you're going to confuse, you're not going to overwhelm them with too much information, and then that'll just leave them, you know, paralyzed to inaction, or there's probably some brilliant phrase. And here's something I just thought of, and this is probably a conversation off camera. What if we did a Skype thing on it? Well, that was his nickname. Yeah, he did say that. He talked about Skype. For real? Yeah, he brought it up. If you would pay attention to it. Yeah. Yeah. He emailed you, right? Yeah, he had a Skype call for me. I thought about the Skype. This is good. One thing I hadn't recommended it yet is because we need to determine who's going to log in. Yeah. Right? Yeah. Somebody needs to be logged on Skype. Yeah, they can call, but Skype kind of gives them the opportunity to communicate with us on a different medium. Yeah. And, you know, we're going to log in. We frankly don't use Skype much here, so, you know, it's something that we'd have to pick up. There's another thing is we use an inter-office chat feature, and it has the ability to put

a live chat, and then you could chat on the website, and then they could chat with the person that they choose that happens to be logged in and live. So, I was playing around with that. We'll get that implemented. I don't know where we're going to squeeze it in on the website. Yeah. But that goes back to the website is always changing because, you know, we know that you can close more deals from having a chat feature. You know, we've got technical partners that are doing it. They've got good statistics on it, and so we know it's something that we should have on our website. It's not something that we felt, you know, it's not, it, there's one thing that I think is a really kind of important rule in business. I'm going all over. This will be my last stop, all right? Everybody on the train. And the rule is, you know, there's a lot of people in business who say, it goes this way, ready, and then they're aiming, and then they're aiming, and then they're aiming, and then they're aiming, and then they're still aiming, and they never fire. And the way we released our website is the opposite. It was like, ready, fire? Okay, where'd that go? Let's aim, right? Because in business, it's often just about getting something out there, right? And then perfecting it. Go find Tony. Because if you, if we waited for this website to be done, done, done, it would probably never get done, because, well, especially because we're in internet marketing, and things are changing every day. You know, we're like, oh, we can't release this week because we have to add Skype. Oh, we can't release this week because we need another type of chat, you know, so get out there and fire. And not just that, you know, I think it goes towards what we were talking about earlier, our target. You know, our target demographic, you know, for people who use our business aren't very tech savvy. I mean, truthfully, they probably

won't be using Skype. Right. Right? They probably won't click contact. Right. They'll call. Yeah. You know, the, the forum, they'll, they will put their website first. Yeah. And so, you know, our website is built in a fashion to target who we serve as best. Right. Not necessarily, you know, our peers. Yeah. Yeah, not necessarily our peers, the listeners of this podcast, most of the listeners of this podcast. Speaking of which, we're, we're a little bit over time. It's great information. I mean, this is, this is really awesome. Thanks to Darren for providing us this critical analysis. We'll get right on top of that sometime. Yeah. Yeah. Paul's actually going to check out our website. Apparently it's new. He was so busy working on his haiku, he didn't have a chance to look at the new. Did you bring it? 5, 7, 5, 9, 10. It would have been whack anyway. It would have been just terrible. Thank you guys. You guys have made us the most popular SEO podcast on iTunes. You know, 3,000 downloads a week is phenomenal. I mean, just phenomenal. Thank you guys. Again, twitter.com slash ewebstyle, facebook.com slash ewebstyle. Hit us up in an email, podcast at e-webstyle.com. Call us, 713-592-6724. Somebody will answer the phone and we'll be happy to help you if you've got any questions. We do do websites. We've got to make sure we mention that. And this has been podcast number 79. Thank you guys for listening. My name's Chris Burris. I'm Paul Hensley. I'm Charles Lewis. Bye-bye for now.